44 Replies Latest reply: Jan 24, 2012 3:10 PM by VancePants RSS

Love how the lack of friendly fire has turned HC into Core Plus...

rankismet

Friendly fire has been removed from HC in MW3. That's sad. A knee jerk reaction to a forseeable issue has resulted in a fundemental way HC is played.

 

HC is now Core Plus.

 

Seriously, IW/SH... you couldn't have anticipated all the little DB's team killing to get their jollies off?

 

It's obvious you hadn't thought about it... or even care about the HC community.

 

* There are no HC operations in Elite.

* HC playtime is not tracked in Elite.

* New playlists to MW3 aren't available for HC.

* Removal of friendly fire.

 

But we have ricochet now... great... you can now drop airstrikes on your team and nothing happens to them. Grenades won't kill your teammate capturing B. Flash a room and only enemy is affected. Sounds a lot like Core... no friendly fire.

 

I know all of the damge splashes back on you... even kills you in some cases. But that is not HC.

 

And the griefers?

 

Well they can just stand in front of you now... stand under your crate as it drops so you can die and they can steal it. They have so many new ways to be a Richard... and all because IW/SH never cared in the first place.

 

I had hoped for #MOARhardcore in MW3.

 

 

I got Core Plus instead.

  • Re: Love how the lack of friendly fire has turned HC into Core Plus...
    ACII

    what does it matter?  It's not like a HC player is gonna get up out of prone and move from his corner.

  • Re: Love how the lack of friendly fire has turned HC into Core Plus...

    Well said, since there is no actual friendly fire it should be called HardCore Suicide Mode as only the shooter/killstreak originator dies along with the enemy as you point out. After about 30 minutes of this mode last night, I hate to say it but I went back to playing Black Ops  Hardcore CTF because, for the most part, that game mode actually works...

     

    I was really enjoying MW3 with the HC Dom...the updated version seems wrong for me. I guess if you like core with no mini map it's a great mode for some folks.

     

    For me, not that it matters to anyone else, I will drop back to Blops for now...

  • Re: Love how the lack of friendly fire has turned HC into Core Plus...
    SmokeyCheese1

    FACT: If your teammate stands under your crate - you DO NOT DIE.

  • Re: Love how the lack of friendly fire has turned HC into Core Plus...

    If your not paying attention and dropping KS on your team mates and are upset your dying then you must have sucked when it was non-ricochet.

     

    As for griefers stepping in front of your bullets. That's just retarded, if your paying attention that wont work, I know because people tried that a lot in ricochet in BLOP's.

     

    People who would grief you in ricochet will grief you in non-ricochet. At least now they cant TK you and take your crate, TK you when diffusing bombs, or TK you just because they can.

     

    Ricochet changes some of the HC mechanics but in the end its still, don't shoot or do anything that will cause a TK because now it only effects you.

     

    I played HC Dom for a few hours after the ricochet patch came out and it still felt exactly like HC. I didn't once TK so I never even noticed the ricochet aspect. Even if I had, it would of been my fault it happened, not his. SO why should he suffer because someone sucks and probably should not play that mode due to a lack of skill and understanding of what its about.

     

    HC is not all about friendly fire. Their are 4 aspects to HC: significantly less life, limited HUD, no kill-cam, and friendly fire.

     

    Even with ricochet taking over the traditional friendly fire you still have all the other aspects just the same. Friendly fire isn't the defining aspect of HC. its only 1 aspect that if you don't TK to begin with you would almost never notice.

    • Re: Love how the lack of friendly fire has turned HC into Core Plus...
      rankismet

      Zurikon wrote:

       

      If your not paying attention and dropping KS on your team mates and are upset your dying then you must have sucked when it was non-ricochet.

       

      As for griefers stepping in front of your bullets. That's just retarded, if your paying attention that wont work, I know because people tried that a lot in ricochet in BLOP's.

       

      People who would grief you in ricochet will grief you in non-ricochet. At least now they cant TK you and take your crate, TK you when diffusing bombs, or TK you just because they can.

       

      Ricochet changes some of the HC mechanics but in the end its still, don't shoot your or do anything that will cause a TK because now it only effects you.

       

      I played HC Dom for a few hours after the ricochet patch came out and it still felt exactly like HC. I didn't once TK so I never even noticed the ricochet aspect. Even if I did it was my fault it happened, not his. SO why should he suffer because someone sucks and probably should play that mode due to a lack of skill and understanding of what its about.

       

      HC is not all about friendly fire. Their are 4 aspects to HC: significantly less life, limited HUD, no kill-cam, and friendly fire.

       

      Even with ricochet taking over the traditional friendly fire you still have all the other aspects just the same. Friendly fire isn't the defining aspect of HC. its only 1 aspect that if you don't TK to begin with you would almost never notice.

       

      Friendly fire is the most central aspect to what makes hardcore, HARDcore.

       

      Thry this tactic tonight:

       

      Run Support and get a Stealth Bomber... have your team set up near a zone, drop your bomber in and have them run under it to the zone. They will now live, the enemy will be dead, and your team can cap the point easy as pie.

       

      That is Core... not HC.

    • Re: Love how the lack of friendly fire has turned HC into Core Plus...
      trialstardragon

      Well said, and I have to agree with the points you made. Just most hc players liked being able to random nade a point and get easy kills. But with ricochet they can not any more because it may kill them too.

       

      I love how ricochet prevents that aspect of the game from being abused anymore. No more random nades at the flag, no more random rpgs at the flag just to get cheap kills at the expense of your teammates life.

       

      I said it once, I will say it again. They remove ricochet and I get killed by a random nade or by a team mate trying to steal a plant or defuse or a care package and I will switch over to my explosive class and team kill everyone until they leave and then leave myself giving the other team an easy win.

       

      As towards the ksr whine, stop using SB or PAS to get kills, use ksr that helps the team and not just your k/dr.

  • Re: Love how the lack of friendly fire has turned HC into Core Plus...
    yarderdunes

    /\ This...

     

    Ricochet is not hardcore.

     

    #0LDHARDCOREGAMEMODES please

     

    Make S&D Ricochet, to satiate the S&D players, and return the rest to the way they were...

  • Re: Love how the lack of friendly fire has turned HC into Core Plus...

    I thought Treyarch blew it with the Bombs and Flags gong show.  That was almost brilliant compared to making every single HC mode ricochet.  From both sides of the TK coin, I would guess that at least 80% of TKs are the fault of the person that dies.  The idiot who steps in front of your gun while your firing.  The brain dead with no mic that goes happy assing into the area you called an airstrike or threw a grenade.

    • Re: Love how the lack of friendly fire has turned HC into Core Plus...
      rankismet

      ArmedYeti wrote:

       

      I thought Treyarch blew it with the Bombs and Flags gong show.  That was almost brilliant compared to making every single HC mode ricochet.  From both sides of the TK coin, I would guess that at least 80% of TKs are the fault of the person that dies.  The idiot who steps in front of your gun while your firing.  The brain dead with no mic that goes happy assing into the area you called an airstrike or threw a grenade.

       

      TA listened to the community and tried a solution to overcome a limitation in BO.

       

      IW/SH just sought the easy way out as they have with everything associated with this title.

       

      When will they #RemoveRicochet?

      • Re: Love how the lack of friendly fire has turned HC into Core Plus...
        iverbure

        i havne't even played MW3 since the update, i've been playing HC CTF on BO causes it the bee's knees.

         

        the lack of support that hc gamemodes is sickening. this isn't going to change until people keep tweeting @fourzerotwo they want changes.

         

         

        What they should do is put richochet on players after they have TK 3 times. this doesn't solve the problem completly but it is the best solution i would think right now. this way people who want to shoot their own team on purposes can only do it 3 times before they kill themselves. thats what your really tryin to stop.

        • Re: Love how the lack of friendly fire has turned HC into Core Plus...

          iverbure, I actually like that idea.  You don't get kicked after three accidental teamkills because of stupid teammates, but after three teamkills, it's on you.  I think that sounds really good and could be implemented realistically.  It's a lot like it was, where after three teamkills you died, but the only difference we the teammate died also everytime.  This way, you only die after the 3rd kill.  Most of my teamkills are accidental, mostly due to teammates crossing my line of fire or running into my grenade or airstrike I clearly notified them of, and getting kicked after 3 of those kills always made me angry as hell.  So, yes, I love this idea of your's.  Unfortunately, IW/SH will most likely never see your idea or implement it.  But I do like it.

        • Re: Love how the lack of friendly fire has turned HC into Core Plus...

          iverbure wrote:

           

          i havne't even played MW3 since the update, i've been playing HC CTF on BO causes it the bee's knees.

           

          the lack of support that hc gamemodes is sickening. this isn't going to change until people keep tweeting @fourzerotwo they want changes.

           

           

          What they should do is put richochet on players after they have TK 3 times. this doesn't solve the problem completly but it is the best solution i would think right now. this way people who want to shoot their own team on purposes can only do it 3 times before they kill themselves. thats what your really tryin to stop.

          I like the suggestions you have for HC.   I think the first 3 should not count as a death for the victim, nor should it stop your killstreak.  I also think if you drop a precision airstrike it shouldn't kill you 3 times because the same teammate is in the middle of it.  Of course he is still in the middle of it because you can't team kill him.  Why on Earth would it kill you 3 times???

  • Re: Love how the lack of friendly fire has turned HC into Core Plus...
    GONExFISHING

    only the players that enjoy teamkilling is crying about this. i love it i havent accedently runned someones killstreak and i havent had my streakruned. if u dont like it play a different game and cry about that one lol

  • Re: Love how the lack of friendly fire has turned HC into Core Plus...

    Im on holiday, and thus havent suffered through all of this ricochet garbage yet, but all of these posts arent making me hopeful. I hate to say it, as I had terrible lag issues no matter what I did, but I may have to make a return to Blops if it truly is as bad as everyone is making it seem.

    • Re: Love how the lack of friendly fire has turned HC into Core Plus...
      cranium2001

      I guess I'm one of the lucky ones, but I usually play in groups of 5 or 6. I can see a legitimate complaint though. People can't just play the game the way it's supposed to be. I had no problem with FF and so far none with ricochet. It's too bad for everyone getting nutted.

      • Re: Love how the lack of friendly fire has turned HC into Core Plus...

        That's why I don't play all these other game types. People just aren't smart enough to be teammates.

         

        The only reason it got patched was because people are so pants-on-head retarded that the game has to cradle them to make sure a gametype is halfway playable. IW is the world's worst when it comes to patching anything so you might as well just quietly suffer in core with the rest of us and let the idiots play HC objectives where they find ways to screw teammates and farm xp

         

        All of this is one reason I don't buy BF3. There are just too many idiots that don't know how or don't want to do things correctly.

         

        You guys might as well give up on ******** about it because until they start punishing the stupid, the smart will get punished seven fold. It's IW. . . it's going to be frustrating from hear until eternity.

  • Re: Love how the lack of friendly fire has turned HC into Core Plus...

    As of now I only play HC KC, and while I don't like ricochet, its not awful. Yes, the precision airstrike is a great way to kill yourself 3 times in a row, but I've learned to pretty much treat it as if I have 2 TK's in a Black Ops game (unless I'm using a SMAW, I fire that with reckless abandon).

     

    And Ran, its a fact, I've personally seen it many, many times: Care packages that hit a teammate kill them, not the recipient.

  • Re: Love how the lack of friendly fire has turned HC into Core Plus...
    asianman12

    I just wish we could get some sort of feedback from a DEV or Robert Bowling about this sort of stuff. But it seems they don't give 2 sh*ts about hardcore.  I love hardcore but when it just feels like Core without a HUD, it makes me feel a tad empty inside.

  • Re: Love how the lack of friendly fire has turned HC into Core Plus...

    At first I was pissed about the ricochet, still kind of am, but it got a little better after I watched some assclown shoot me for my care package then died instead. I laughed so hard when that happened. I hated team killers so much before this, now I don't have to worry so much about it. The one thing that does annoy me however is having to take deaths that I could have shot through my team mate to avoid it or in similar circumstances. I liked trearcs kicking people out of the match policy. Sure it was annoying but everyone adjusted to it well and it didnt happen on accident but rarely, talking about my teams experience of course. I have to agree though that they shouldn't have changed it in the first place, it was quite the unexpected and unwanted suprise.

  • Re: Love how the lack of friendly fire has turned HC into Core Plus...
    trialstardragon

    You all must be forgetting that IW has the right to change any aspect of MP that they want to make the game better and fair in their eyes regardless if any of you do not like it at all. MP is a privilege not a right to play. It can be changed or taken away when ever IW wants too.

     

    Yes there may have been options that may have been better but they went of ra quick fix to the problem. It they had waited to do a long fix, more people would be complaing about it just as bad as you that do not like ricochet are doing now. IW knows they can not keep everyone happy all the time. So they used a blanket fix to eliminate the biggest part of the problem and it does do this for those that pay attention to what is going on and who is around them.

     

    Simple. Do not fire in to a group of players when a team mate is there. Do not toss a nade at an obj when a team mate is there. Do not use precisioun air strike, or stealth bomber to just rack up kills with out caring who is around just so YOU can get more kills. It is called TEAM for a reason. Stop only caring about your own k/dr all the time.

     

    Even simpler, play with a group of friends and just have fun. It is after all just a game not important. And the stats in this game mean nothing when the game is turned off. At least to anyone with a normal life they do not.

    • Re: Love how the lack of friendly fire has turned HC into Core Plus...

      This is not complaing about dying from ricochet. This is is about how the lack of Friendly Fire has turned into Core Plus. It's NOT hardcore anymore! It's just a core without an HUD and you die if you do anything to "teamkill" them.

       

       

      The WHOLE funny part about this is, is that team killing was only a problem in Hardcore S&D. IW just took an lazy fix and put ricochet in EVERY mode.

       

      Ricochet is prefrect for S&D, but it is a nightmare for TDM and DOM.

       

      At least they could have done was make it OPTIONAL to make everybody happy.

      Or just make it like MW2.

      Hardcore Team Death Match

      Hardcore Ricochet: S&D

      Hardcore Ricochet: HQ

      Hardcore Mosh Pit.

      That sounds MUCH better than what the hardcore playlist we have now.

      • Re: Love how the lack of friendly fire has turned HC into Core Plus...

        The HC element is still there with the lack of health regen, I see so many rubbish MOAB videos of core players getting shot up, running to a corner and letting their health recover, just to repeat the process a few kills later. In HC that would be no MOAB for j00.

        • Re: Love how the lack of friendly fire has turned HC into Core Plus...
          rankismet

          Vic27 wrote:

           

          The HC element is still there with the lack of health regen, I see so many rubbish MOAB videos of core players getting shot up, running to a corner and letting their health recover, just to repeat the process a few kills later. In HC that would be no MOAB for j00.

           

          Health fairly makes all things easier for sure.

           

          I have seen two MOABs in HC... both by a friend of mine who was camping his bahookey off while we collected the tags he was making.

           

          Never been hit by an enemy one in more than 7 days of HC KC.

    • Re: Love how the lack of friendly fire has turned HC into Core Plus...
      rankismet

      trialstardragon wrote:

       

      You all must be forgetting that IW has the right to change any aspect of MP that they want to make the game better and fair in their eyes regardless if any of you do not like it at all. MP is a privilege not a right to play. It can be changed or taken away when ever IW wants too.

       

      Yes there may have been options that may have been better but they went of ra quick fix to the problem. It they had waited to do a long fix, more people would be complaing about it just as bad as you that do not like ricochet are doing now. IW knows they can not keep everyone happy all the time. So they used a blanket fix to eliminate the biggest part of the problem and it does do this for those that pay attention to what is going on and who is around them.

       

      Simple. Do not fire in to a group of players when a team mate is there. Do not toss a nade at an obj when a team mate is there. Do not use precisioun air strike, or stealth bomber to just rack up kills with out caring who is around just so YOU can get more kills. It is called TEAM for a reason. Stop only caring about your own k/dr all the time.

       

      Even simpler, play with a group of friends and just have fun. It is after all just a game not important. And the stats in this game mean nothing when the game is turned off. At least to anyone with a normal life they do not.

       

      I've played more than enough HC to get what to do and not to do...

       

      Ricochet was the easy fix... pure and simple.

       

       

      This thread was not about stats. HC gameplay has been changed by this in such a way that it plays more like Core than HC.

    • Re: Love how the lack of friendly fire has turned HC into Core Plus...

      wow!!!! REALLY?!!! The fact that you play with us dragon, you should know our style of play and know that if we do accidently kill a team mate it's on accident. I have to agree it's not the same since they put ricochete in hc tdm. We have all adjusted, ie: Nemo knowing he is going to die when he drops that airstrike, but IW shouldn't have blanketed ricochete on all hc games. I agree that the formula stated earlier in previous posts would work. MW2 playlists and BLOP's 3 kill rule.

      • Re: Love how the lack of friendly fire has turned HC into Core Plus...
        rankismet

        JrodMidion wrote:

         

        wow!!!! REALLY?!!! The fact that you play with us dragon, you should know our style of play and know that if we do accidently kill a team mate it's on accident. I have to agree it's not the same since they put ricochete in hc tdm. We have all adjusted, ie: Nemo knowing he is going to die when he drops that airstrike, but IW shouldn't have blanketed ricochete on all hc games. I agree that the formula stated earlier in previous posts would work. MW2 playlists and BLOP's 3 kill rule.

         

        IW/SH just simply did not think this through...

  • Re: Love how the lack of friendly fire has turned HC into Core Plus...

    COD3 had it right.

     

    You TK me, I get the option to punish or forgive you (accidents happen). After being punished 3 times total you get booted.

     

    Simple fix. let the players police the community. I know, that would take some1 at IW to use thier head instead of blanketing HC with richocette.

     

    Why IW hasnt picked this up or just the simple 3 TK boot is beyond me. Ohh thats because they just dont care about HC. 402 always puts HC down as if there are 4 people playing it while we have 2 TeamTac modes that no1 plays yet that ok and HCHQ is out of the question.

     

    You know, the game mode that has been available since COD4. One of teh MOST played HC modes. No big deal. WE HAVE MOSH PIT AGAIN!

     

    IW is clearly having an "awsome dialog" with some community other than COD's.

  • Re: Love how the lack of friendly fire has turned HC into Core Plus...

    Both friendly fire and Ricochet are retarded.

     

    I don't play hardcore but these are my ideas:

     

    - Friendly Fire kills teammates, but

    - the victim doesn't lose his pointstreak for anything

    - the killer loses a point on his pointstreak

    - no penalty doled out on the killer for deaths by airstrike

    - you get a "three teamkill" limit

      - this number is clearly listed on the HUD

      - each "teamkill" lasts for two minutes, afterwards it is removed from the counter

      - if you hit three, you're booted.

     

    This should be a good solution for a future COD.

  • Re: Love how the lack of friendly fire has turned HC into Core Plus...

    dude im just waiting for them to remove ricochet so I can go back to smaw trolling my teammates LOL