27 Replies Latest reply: Dec 9, 2012 5:43 AM by maccabi RSS

Hardcore modes now softcore, bring back spawn times.

After the recent update I noticed that the spawn times had gone from HC team deathmatch. A decision treyarch has clearly not thought through, it's the very reason that they put spawn times on HC team deathmatch in the first place. It's because it's a TEAM effort, you die, then all respawn together and go and try a take back control together, like a TEAM would.

Also I'm finding that it becomes more of a 1 on 1 game of cat and mouse now, you kill the enemy and before you can reload your gun the same guy shoots you in the back, you instantly respawn shoot him within seconds. There's no time for a head start getaway.

The main and most important reason for this complaint though is because I enjoy a bourbon some nights while I play, those crucial few seconds are all I need to keep me going then top up the glass between matches. It's like the symbiotic relationship between HCTD and alcohol has just died, how sad.

Oh we'll, just got to roll with what the fun police dish out, that's life.

 

P.s. bring back HC FFA as well, kill confirmed Is too unrealistic.

  • Re: Hardcore modes now softcore, bring back spawn times.
    GWS24

    I agree, HC TDM was destroyed by this change.

  • Re: Hardcore modes now softcore, bring back spawn times.
    KTPhoenix

    Hell no. I for one love the fact they did away with the spawn delay. I wanted the spawn delay gone ever since MW2.

    • Re: Hardcore modes now softcore, bring back spawn times.
      GWS24

      How often do you play HC TDM may I ask?

      • Re: Hardcore modes now softcore, bring back spawn times.
        KTPhoenix

        It is the only game mode I play as a matter of fact. I even played a few matches earlier this morning.

         

        And you are completely exaggerating. HC is NOT destroyed by this.

        • Re: Hardcore modes now softcore, bring back spawn times.
          GWS24

          Ok. Me too. It's all I play. About to head on now.  The team aspect has been dramatically effected.  Communication is not as solid.  Pace is so fast in increases rage.  No time to cool down after a death.  No chance to watch others while they play, or show off to others when they are watching you.

           

          So many negatives....

          • Re: Hardcore modes now softcore, bring back spawn times.
            KTPhoenix

            And how has communication been effected anymore in this game than in previous titles? As far as I am aware, there is still just as much lack of communication in this game as every other COD title that has come out.

             

            You cant blame that on the removal of the spawn delay. I think you are just making stuff up now.

            • Re: Hardcore modes now softcore, bring back spawn times.
              GWS24

              I play with full teams, trust me, we communicate.  The lack of spawn means that people don't need to inform their team the left side is breached because they will spawn back immediately and make an effort to go back and get a revenge kill.  Also the increased pace makes it more difficult to communicate because there is no more down time.  I am in favor of a shorter respwn delay, but you need something to slow the game down.  The pace is what separted this mode from others.

               

              As an example on communication, I was playing last night and my friend says, "there is a guy by the, ah never mind I will go get him".

               

              You were having issues with communicating before, its probably because of the team you were with.

               

              Hit me up if you would like

               

              IIII GWS IIII

        • Re: Hardcore modes now softcore, bring back spawn times.
          GWS24

          None of my friends like it.  One that did originally, changed is mind.

          • Re: Hardcore modes now softcore, bring back spawn times.
            KTPhoenix

            And your point is? Just because you and your friends dont like it and a few people on here dont like it doesnt mean the whole HC community hates it.

            • Re: Hardcore modes now softcore, bring back spawn times.
              GWS24

              My point is that in the sample (exit poll if you will) that I have taken, people don't like it. 

               

              I don't believe the HC community favors it, but what do I know.

              • Re: Hardcore modes now softcore, bring back spawn times.
                maccabi

                GWS24 wrote:

                 

                My point is that in the sample (exit poll if you will) that I have taken, people don't like it. 

                 

                I don't believe the HC community favors it, but what do I know.

                you do know the change came because Vahn ASKED the hc community right?

                 

                so basically he did what you did and had a poll, the overwhelming reply from the community was remove it as it made tdm too slow.

                 

                3arc didnt just change it without asking first.

                • Re: Hardcore modes now softcore, bring back spawn times.

                  This is exactly why I think COD should be run like a dictatorship. Reason being is just because the majority of 10 year old try hards ask for less time until next engagement, smaller maps, basically all the things that have contributed to BO2 being the biggest COD cluster*** game ever, shows that sometimes the developers should make their own grown up decisions taking into consideration the bigger picture and what's best for overall game balance.

                   

                  Pretty much everything that is wrong with this game can be attributed to "listening to the community" and the misinterpretation of stats.

                   

                  If democratic governments put every decision to a referendum then countries would be is disarray as they would hand over decision making to those that are less experienced and less educated.

                  • Re: Hardcore modes now softcore, bring back spawn times.
                    maccabi

                    iCOMPACT wrote:

                     

                    shows that sometimes the developers should make their own grown up decisions taking into consideration the bigger picture and what's best for overall game balance.

                     

                    I can tell you for fact 3arc and especially Vahn, do make their own decisions, People seem to be under the misconception that they asked us and as we said one thing thats why they did it.

                     

                    I like a few of us on here know Vahns thought process for hc decisions pretty well  , we tested all the hc modes in blops1 with him and he had a long chat with those involved as to why things get changed / tweaked ect I can assure you his over riding rule on everything is what is better for the game overall. IW use the same reasoning, we put up good arguements for changes in hc for mw3 and some made it some didnt as they felt even with strong arguements for something it wasnt best overlal for the game.

                     

                    To give you an idea , when we tested the hc modes in blops1 he made us basically play the same game of sab on same map over and over with different spawn delays/ wave spawns ect as he wanted to make sure the setting chosen was the best to use in game. I woulod assume the same process was tried with tdm in house where the devs played and decided what was better for the game mode overall, and along with that and the over whelming replies of remove the spawn timer was the reason it was changed.

                     

                     

                    The thing is the hc community although alot smaller is also one of the most vocal when something isnt right to their liking, Vahn is really good when it comes to listening to us as a community BUT from experience offering a solution or suggestion to change something and the reasons why have a much better chance of sucess,

                     

                    For example the spawn delay removal, coming on here like people are just complkaining and insulting isnt really helping the cause, maybe come up with a workable compromise that everyone would be happy with.

                    • Re: Hardcore modes now softcore, bring back spawn times.
                      xXOneMunkXx

                      *Off Topic*

                       

                      How is it that you come into a position to be able to work with the dev's in such a manner? Just curious because I would absolutely love to be able to work towards bettering the community/gameplay. 

                       

                      *Back on topic*

                       

                      As far as spawn times being completely removed, I don't personally agree with it.  Although I didn't per say enjoy a 15 second respawn after being spawn killed (not that there is much control over that), I did enjoy the slower pace the TDM provided.  TDM as it is without spawn times feels more like Kill Confirmed minus having to pick up tags.  It definitely changed the gameplay from a strategic standpoint.  I personally would have been more satisfied with a 7 second spawn delay rather than completely removing it entirely.  Spawn delay in my experience playing with my clan allowed us to coordinate ourselves better.  Gave us time to lay down a strategy to make an attempt at turning the tables.  Of course we're all going to adapt to the change eventually, but perhaps a less drastic change to the game play would have eased the tension and avioded at least some of the ranting (in theory, people will never be satisfied because we all have different opinions).  I personally would rather see changes in small increments that allow us to adapt over time.  At least that way there is some middle ground in the discussion. 

                    • Re: Hardcore modes now softcore, bring back spawn times.
                      GWS24

                      I would certainly be fine with a running 10 second clock or a flat 7 second delay.  It does suck when you get hit with a 14 or 15 second delay.  We just need something to slow the pace.

                       

                      I've tried to be thoughtful with all my posts and not act like a child because, as an adult, I know acting like a child will get us knowhere.

                • Re: Hardcore modes now softcore, bring back spawn times.
                  GWS24

                  Yes I know, it has been posted several times recently.  I had commented to Vahn via twitter (as mentioned in other posts yesterday).

  • Re: Hardcore modes now softcore, bring back spawn times.
    trialstardragon

    You are so wrong it is not even funny. There was no reason for there to be any sort of spawn delay in this game in the first place. Not even CTF really needs it. In fact no playlist needs it.

     

    Spawn delays are for loser teams taht can not handle an active team continueing to deny them an advance.

     

    There is no reason to spawn in masse and then rush a point like iditos thinking that mass numbers will get any better results.

     

    I have taken out 3 players at a time that tried to rush me, when spawn delay was still in the game and I was last alive on my team. And managed to hold the enemy back until my team respawned and we still kept control over the section of the map I was in.

     

    With no spawn delay, it is harder to do that. because I now have less time to reload and have to be smart about when I do. So it is better this way, not worse.

     

    with spaw delay, it was stupid and easy to dominate a map even if you were the only member on your team alive.

    • Re: Hardcore modes now softcore, bring back spawn times.
      GWS24

      Opinions can't be wrong.

       

      In my opinion (and many others) the game mode has completly changed for the worse.

      • Re: Hardcore modes now softcore, bring back spawn times.
        FAded_DrEamz

        HELL NO!!! NO SPAWN TIME ON HCKC!!! I don't like watching 1/3 of my game time.. Good call treyarch on no spawn timer for HCKC.. Us true HCKC players don't want the spawn time.. It's crap!

      • Re: Hardcore modes now softcore, bring back spawn times.
        trialstardragon

        you are correct and wrong at the same time, in your view it is ruined; but not in everyone elses veiw. Just those taht do not want to adapt to the new way to play. So no its not ruined, just you do not like it because it does not cater to how you want or expect to play anymore.

         

        Either adapt, or quit playing. it is not going back to how it was.

        • Re: Hardcore modes now softcore, bring back spawn times.
          FAded_DrEamz

          God I hope ur right Trial, no more spawn time ever!!!

        • Re: Hardcore modes now softcore, bring back spawn times.
          GWS24

          How do you know its never going to revert back to the way it has been for several years???

           

          Also, it seems like more people on here are in favor of a spawn delay.

          • Re: Hardcore modes now softcore, bring back spawn times.
            trialstardragon

            The number that post on here mad about it make up less than 10% of the players that play the game. So the voices heard hear are a minority really.

             

            the numbers currently playing the different hc game modes with the change speak for themself. And as long as those numbers stay as they are or even get even 1% larger the choice will be considered a good one.

             

            And just because that is how it was in past games, does not mean that is how it will always stay in all games. Never ever, think that, for to do so is stupid.

            • Re: Hardcore modes now softcore, bring back spawn times.
              GWS24

              People will play it even if they don't like it.  Take me for example, I hate it now, yet I played probably 10 hours yesterday and have logged an hour this morning.  Numbers lie.  So the negative posts should be considered.

               

              Let me give you an example of what just happened to me.

               

              Sniping on Drone on the helipad.  Guy comes up through the building and kills me.  Good for him, nice job, fail on my part for not setting equipment and for my team to not cover the right side appropriately.  He then proceeds to run down the helipad and kill me THREE additional times as I immediately spawn in at base of the helipad spawn.  Fortunately one of my teamates killed him to stop the madness.

               

              Let me guess Macabi, here is where you chime in and say "that was a spawn issue, not a spawn delay issue".  Let me stop you before you start....they are interrelated issues!

               

              As far as adapting....who knows....I may, I may not time will tell.

               

              This game mode has been destroyed, people are pissed (they have made themselves known here) and I can tell you from actually playing it and conversing with friends and randoms, its not a popular change.

              • Re: Hardcore modes now softcore, bring back spawn times.
                maccabi

                GWS24 wrote:

                 

                 

                Let me guess Macabi, here is where you chime in and say "that was a spawn issue, not a spawn delay issue".  Let me stop you before you start....they are interrelated issues!

                 

                 

                They are inter related only in as much as the spawn system does NOT decide where to spawn you based on the delay of the spawn, you will still spawn where the game says you should under the placement rules .

                 

                having a delay has NO affect on where you spawn, that is determined on where your team are, where the enemy team is.

                 

                basically when you die your sitting twiddling your thumbs for x number of seconds thats it.

        • Re: Hardcore modes now softcore, bring back spawn times.

          I for 1 had no idea they were going to rid the respawn time, only the core players complaints were heard as the true hardcore players were just kicking back happy with the setup they had. I do understand that waiting for up to 15s can seen like an eternity for kids, but for us adult gamers a strategical game is what we like.

          Maybe they should have made 10s spawns then it would have only a 5s average respawn time. Just to compromise rather than to eliminate. That way I could enjoy my bourbon still lol.

          Or why not have a completely new team deathmatch mode and leave us hardcores to ours.

  • Re: Hardcore modes now softcore, bring back spawn times.

    I am going to have to give HC a go again. I do enjoy it a lot but, I am not a fan of the 15 second timer.