28 Replies Latest reply: Oct 17, 2011 9:54 AM by IRAssault100 RSS

Hardline: A waste AND a must?

JPE777

Am I missing something here but when running the support strike package where your streak isnt reset upon death, wont hardline be pretty much useless?

 

And by the same token, when running the specialist strike package, its a near virtual must as getting it later on in your streak would negate its power by a considerable margin.

 

Or am I missing something here? Maybe the pro version is more powerful then Im giving it credit for? 

  • Hardline: A waste AND a must?

    why would it be useless, it reduces the streak by 1 kill

    • Hardline: A waste AND a must?
      JPE777

      I kow that the perk will still "work" when using the support package but the fact that they dont reset reduces its power/effectiveness.

       

      For example, if you have an 8 streak selected (I believe its the SAM Turret) and die with 7 kills/points without hardline, you still only need one more point to attain this reward. In this example, all that hardline will do is mean you end up getting your reward (in this case SAM Turret) just slightly sooner.

       

      However, when using the assault or specialist package, there'll be much bigger difference in "cost" when using hardline or not. You die on 7 points without hardline in these cases, its going to take much longer to get back to that position, if not at all.

  • Hardline: A waste AND a must?
    iif0xh0undii

    I'm all for using Hardline. I'm capable of high end killstreaks, but I care about my team and the others that are much more efficient at racking those types of KS up quickly.

     

    I'll be utilizing Hardline for the 3/4/5 and 4/5/8 Assault and Support packages.

     

    My goal is to keep my teammates aware, our location hidden and the KS out of the sky. I think its extremely useful

  • Hardline: A waste AND a must?
    jamesafc

    I guess Hardline will be more useful with the Assault + Specialist strike packages..

     

    The Pro version will still be useful for the Support package though - Every two assists count as a kill towards their next pointstreak

  • Hardline: A waste AND a must?

    ok heres the diference for you:

    get 3 sam turret in a game = 3x8 points = 24

    the same with hard line= 3x7points =21

    so yea you could get more kisstreaks in the same game with less points

    • Hardline: A waste AND a must?
      JPE777

      Oh very true. But in the "traditional" sense that both assault and specialist packages will have, its not just the totals that are reduced but that the burden of streaking together is reduced. This second element (or 'power') of hardline is now severly negated when using the support package as there is no longer any burden of streaking, due them not being reset.

       

      For example (and assume SAM Turret is available in the assault package and is also 8 kill/pts):

       

      With hardline

       

      Get 7 pts consecutively, three times = 3 SAM Turrets

       

      Without hardline

       

      Get 7 pts consecutively multiple times but no higher = ) SAM Turrets

       

      To me, that really does discourage using hardline over another tier 2 perk when using the support package.

       

      Yet when running with specialist, I can see how anyone would choose anything BU hardline. 1) To help the burden of reaching 7 kills to unlock everything 2) To actually get hardline to anything for you at all (as having it as one the huge group you pick up on that 8th kill means its completely wasted.)

  • Hardline: A waste AND a must?
    vims1990

    I'm excited more about Hardline Pro, than Hardline itself.

     

    The number of times my kills have been stolen in previous COD games is no more.

    I'll spam grenades and concussions all day with Scavenger Pro & Hardline Pro in MW3.

     

    Treyarch's Hardline Pro forced you to use the care package and I despise using the care package. I want to be on the move getting my kills, not getting 4 kills and waiting for that damn care package (and suddenly while attempting to change it, my ******* of a teammate blocks me from doing so and steals my care package)

     

    Hardline will be useful with any package (especially with support)

    • Hardline: A waste AND a must?
      esmorgue

      I agree. I hated trying to roll a package and just having some moron standing right by it. the owner of the package should've automatically cancelled any action by another. MW3s Hardline will be far superior to MW2s version. It was pretty useless on there.

       

      I will love the advantage of assists counting now. I just pray that the whining doesn't start about it.

      • Hardline: A waste AND a must?

        i hated that in black ops ive lost chopper gunners and dogs because of some idiot changing th carepackage they should have made where only you can change it and no one else

        • Hardline: A waste AND a must?
          vims1990

          As much as I hated care packages, Hardline Pro only worked effectively if you played with friends running care packages as well.

           

          It rarely works if you play as a lone-wolf due to the number of idiot teammates swapping your Blackbird to a Spy Plane.

           

          The best possible way to fix Hardline Pro and care packages in Black Ops is an override function which allows you to take over the care package which prevents your teammate from touching it (unless you give permission to do so).

    • Hardline: A waste AND a must?
      iif0xh0undii

      vims1990 wrote:

       

       

      Treyarch's Hardline Pro forced you to use the care package and I despise using the care package. I want to be on the move getting my kills, not getting 4 kills and waiting for that damn care package (and suddenly while attempting to change it, my ******* of a teammate blocks me from doing so and steals my care package)

       

      What? No it doesn't. Hardline Pro doesn't force you to utilize a carepackage. Perhaps before they patched it, when it was geared toward "box" KSs, but afterwards it was applicable to any KS plan. You can achieve exactly what you just stated that you want and still serve as a resource for your team. In my opinion, any feeling that you are being forced to play in a predetermined manner are products of doubt and paranoia.

      • Hardline: A waste AND a must?
        vims1990

        To utilise the pro perk, yes it did make the perk somewhat useless if you didn't use the care package. As a team player, sure you could change the care package for your teammates but most players don't use a mic therefore you lose that chance to assist them to change their Spy Plane into Dogs (for example)

         

        Also, the times I wanted to change my care package were often lost due to teammates crowding like crows around my care package & waiting to snatch it from me while I'm trying to change it.

         

        Treyarch in my opinion should have implemented an override so while someone is attempting to "steal" your care package, you can override it and still be given the chance to change it.

         

        These complaints to Ghost and Flak Jacket in Black Ops weren't really about the perk but also the other perks (Hardline, Scavenger & Lightweight) didn't compete to their pro variants.

         

        So to make other perks beneficial, you make them worthy for all players to use hence why the new Hardline Pro is more applicable to all players.

         

        Players say Assassin will be most used. I say not. Hardline Pro will be a perk to beat especially with the pro benefits. I'm using Scavenger Pro & Hardline Pro to make the most of the perk. When you think about it, all the assists are "team orientated" anyway so both the teammate who gets the kill and myself who get's the assist will get rewarded towards our pointstreak.

        • Re: Hardline: A waste AND a must?
          iif0xh0undii

          You say teammates, but are you playing with a real team? Are you getting a group of 3-5 people together to play whatever it is you fancy? If not, then I can see why you have this perception. If you are, your teammates are a bunch of ********.

           

          I suppose you're focusing on the Pro variant of the perk to dictate the way it is meant to be used? Hardline Pro is a fairly generous offer that comes with it's inherent limitations. This why I stated earlier that you can still achieve what it is that you want and be a resource. If you have a full team, and they want to focus on other perks, your choice will be of great value for anyone that likes the CP.

           

          The only reason I can muster as to why you're arguing against this is still rooted in a pre-established self-doubt that you can't reach those KS or that you're only effective use of the perk is to get a CP. It's blatantly obvious that a perk doesn't restrict you to a certain KS. It may facilitate some, but it can still be utilized in other means.

           

          I think Assassin and whatever other perks needed to keep you out of KS sight are going to be most used.

  • Hardline: A waste AND a must?

    i like the sound of hardline pro but i think assassin or blast shield will be used the most

    • Hardline: A waste AND a must?
      esmorgue

      I think people will start by trying Assasin just because coming form Black Ops. Though I could really see alot of the more skilled/vet players will want to take advantage of OK, HL, QD, BS. I'm about to Splooge on myself thinking about the game. HA HA!

  • Re: Hardline: A waste AND a must?
    maccabi

    I actually dont like the hl pro thing of assists/points counting to killstreaks, imo it will cause a massive inbalance in the game, its so easy to get assists in cod, so you can basically sit back from the action and spam nades. noob tubes, lower killstreaks and basically get assists towards higher killstreaks.

     

    once again in an mw game they have managed to idiot proof getting high killstreaks, hate stackable killstreaks , and really hate this new system deisgned to make it even easier.

    • Hardline: A waste AND a must?
      iif0xh0undii

      This is essentially how I feel too about the Pro Perk variant. Someone could maximize their KS presence without executing what I believe is the proper amount of effort to earn it. Teamwork should always be rewarded, but not in this manner.

      • Re: Hardline: A waste AND a must?
        kourtvizion

        I disagree.  I don't think its rewarding lack of effort.  In a team based game you shouldn't be rewarded for just kills or it changes the mentality of the individual from I want to help my team win to I need to get mine. 

         

         

        There are many times where you put 3 bullets into someone and then someone puts the finishing touch on them and they get rewarded the kill.  Should you not be rewarded for your contribution to the score? 2 assists = 1 point towards a killstreak is fair.  Look at your the average amount of assists in the last 5 games.   I have a total of 22 assists in the last 5 games.  Thats about 4 assists per game which equals two extra points per game. I dont think its game altering. Believe me it wasnt a lack of effort in trying to kill the other players but I don't mind because in the grand scheme of things, my team benefits from my actions.

         

        You have to have Hardline pro for this to take effect and im not exactly sure that it will be that widely used.  We might be worrying over nothing but I don't think it will be a game changer..   

         

        I seriously think they should look at when you save a teammate from an enemy.  It may not look like a big deal but on the score board its a two point swing.  (-1 from the enemy from the kill they didnt get and +1 for your team)  In tight games that makes a huge difference.

        • Re: Hardline: A waste AND a must?
          iif0xh0undii

          In the same respect...

           

          In the context of a team based game, you shouldn't add significant and, in my opinion, selfish value to helping team mates. It should be a natural part of the game that is not emphasized by total award in time.

           

          The "ease of use" that I am referring to is minimal effort of a single bullet into a target without concern of whether or not the target, that will be engaged by another, is eliminated. That's when the aspect of "team" relatively breaks down in my opinion. I don't want that in a game. Now, I thoroughly agree that if the kill was yours, i.e., receiving 80pts in BLOPS, that you should be able to obtain some reward over time.

           

          You're right. It might not be a game changer, but it's the possibility of entire behavioral changes, i.e., aggressive trick-shotting, that I am displeased with. I'm more of a "core mechanics" kind of person than an "open for interpretation" one.

          • Re: Hardline: A waste AND a must?
            kourtvizion

            Agreed.  I understand that certain individuals will abuse the system and make adjustments to their behaviour to benefit from this system but I believe this percentage to be minimal and beneficial to the team.  (Selfish help is an oxymoron)

             

             

            Such actions might have dire consequences when aiming assault strike packages.  Taking the risk of putting one bullet into a target with hopes of others finishing what you started might not be in their best interest knowing that streaks reset.

             

             

            I know there are many scenarios that you could think of people not deserving points towards their streaks and I can think of many reasons why they do.  I think we have to see what the effect of this is on game before we revisit whether or not it should be in the game.

             

             

            P.S .. I dont believe in that statement "you stole my kill."  On a team you would never say hey you stole my goal.  If you did you probably wouldn't be there very long or you would notice differences in the way teammates treat you. I dont see being part of a team in hockey any different than being part of a team in COD.  Everyone should work together for the best interest of the team.

            • Re: Hardline: A waste AND a must?
              iif0xh0undii

              I agree that the percentage may be minimal, but the fact that it exists is what I find irritating. I shouldn't worry about it in truth, as I'll be playing with a full team day one, but I really expect COD not to allow such minute things to occur. The full package should be a well executed and thought out plan.

               

              I don't believe in that statement either. I'm there for my team to win.

  • Hardline: A waste AND a must?

    i dont see the big deal with hardline pro what would you rather have deathstreaks take one less death to get or the way it was in black ops imagine how much moaning there would be on here

    • Hardline: A waste AND a must?
      esmorgue

      I like this variation of the Pro, and Black Ops. MW2 was pointless. I never used it to get a nuke. It sucked to be on a kill streak and some morons you just ran through drops a terd

      • Re: Hardline: A waste AND a must?
        IRAssault100

        you found it to be useless in mw2?.. i found it very helpful, slap it on a class then use, for instance, ACR Red Dot with OMA get yourself a uav (note this is for 3-4-5 killstreak) then oma to a hardline class one more kill = pred then and you get your C-UAV/Care package. That is how i used it.