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      • 20. Re: 4 HC modes at launch...
        rankismet

        rlbl wrote:

         

        Not quoting numbers, because they would be false but...

         

        Has this not been a problem since BO1 (and likely before)?  Remember "Bombs and Flags"? I believe the basic reason was there was not enough people playing HC (or some games modes of HC) to warrant maintaining the lists.

         

        My memory could be off, I am old.

         

        I find it disappointing (I am primarily a HC player, and was very pissed because my friends ONLY played HC HQ in BO1), but my gut tells me that either:

         

        - They are not deliberately trying to piss off the HC community

        - The player base numbers do not warrant the inclusion of all (or at least of the most popular) game modes in HC

        - The potential of pissing off that % of the community is a blip on the total player base*

         

        * the 3rd was a random thought from a business perspective background, not saying it has any merit

         

        Well... I would say...

         

        • The MP dev is certainly not supporting the HC community.
        • The player numbers are between 20-30% of all players
          • More people play HC KC than Core.
          • Most Core players play TDM
        • It's not small.

         

         

        • 21. Re: 4 HC modes at launch...
          rlbl

          Thx... note: I am not arguing, I am playing devil's advocate.

           

          Those stats show the HC community is large, but again playing devil's advocate, that is yet but one snapshot (of many I am sure... but is it always like his? I am thinking not).

           

          The real question is: what are the overall stats the devs are using on which they are making decisions (as well as the rationale).  The stats of numbers are maybe not the only thing they are basing on. Going out on a limb here, but what if they can (or only wish to) handle a certain player base, or supporting certain games modes. So the decision could be that some modes drop off the table because not enough people play them*

           

          * I note the pasting is of KC (which I would be surprised if they dropped)... but what about game modes specifically they have dropped ? Maybe the numbers did not look so good in those modes? I dunno.. remember, I am just playing devil's advocate here, as I am primarily a HC player myself, which is no secret.  I would love it if all modes were available in HC (although the numbers may make it some games would take a lot longer to fill a lobby )

           

          Although you and I make love KC, that is not the only game mode the community is asking for... So maybe they are not in support of the full community as you suggest (they certainly pissed of the CTF and FFA players, and myself as a HQ player), but maybe (just maybe) they are supporting the porting of the community who support the game modes, thus making those ones popular enough to keep.  just thinking out loud.

          • 22. Re: 4 HC modes at launch...
            rlbl

            rankismet wrote:

             

            rlbl wrote:

             

            - The potential of pissing off that % of the community is a blip on the total player base*

             

            * the 3rd was a random thought from a business perspective background, not saying it has any merit

             

            Well... I would say...

             

            • The MP dev is certainly not supporting the HC community.
            • The player numbers are between 20-30% of all players
              • More people play HC KC than Core.
              • Most Core players play TDM
            • It's not small.

             

             

            Note the statement was from the point of view of the modes they got rid of (or replaced). I was not asking about the community as a whole.  If 25-30% are HC players, but a game mode only has 1% of the community, in my mind it would be at the top of list to be on the chopping block, assuming I had to chop anything at all.  So again, the question becomes (from a overall stats point of view), why did that mode need to be chopped?

             

            Not sure if my question is clear; and it is a question that only someone at the decision making table can answer without speculation.

            • 23. Re: 4 HC modes at launch...
              maccabi

              well Iw have spoken I have complete trust in Iw to listen and act on feedback unlike a certian other studio who promised to do the same thing and a 80 page thread later nada

              but i think the point is and one that carries over to cod in general there's an element of never buy a pig in a poke nowadays with cod especially for hc which seems to get shafted more and more each year

              Candice Capen @candyslexia2h

              we haven't released any playlist info. & when the game is out it is very simple to update them based on feedback

              • 24. Re: 4 HC modes at launch...

                I can't think of anything worse than search and destroy, wait hardcore search, yeah that would be way worse.

                 

                 

                 

                I agree I don't know why hardcore isn't an option for all gametypes, for those that like to play it. I never have, don't have a problem with the damage it's more a problem of losing the HuD.

                • 25. Re: 4 HC modes at launch...
                  rankismet

                  rlbl wrote:

                   

                  Thx... note: I am not arguing, I am playing devil's advocate.

                   

                  Those stats show the HC community is large, but again playing devil's advocate, that is yet but one snapshot (of many I am sure... but is it always like his? I am thinking not).

                   

                  The real question is: what are the overall stats the devs are using on which they are making decisions (as well as the rationale).  The stats of numbers are maybe not the only thing they are basing on. Going out on a limb here, but what if they can (or only wish to) handle a certain player base, or supporting certain games modes. So the decision could be that some modes drop off the table because not enough people play them*

                   

                  * I note the pasting is of KC (which I would be surprised if they dropped)... but what about game modes specifically they have dropped ? Maybe the numbers did not look so good in those modes? I dunno.. remember, I am just playing devil's advocate here, as I am primarily a HC player myself, which is no secret.  I would love it if all modes were available in HC (although the numbers may make it some games would take a lot longer to fill a lobby )

                   

                  Although you and I make love KC, that is not the only game mode the community is asking for... So maybe they are not in support of the full community as you suggest (they certainly pissed of the CTF and FFA players, and myself as a HQ player), but maybe (just maybe) they are supporting the porting of the community who support the game modes, thus making those ones popular enough to keep.  just thinking out loud.

                   

                  I actually look at these numbers all the time.

                   

                  There has been... and continues to be... no real justification for the lack of community support.

                  • 26. Re: 4 HC modes at launch...
                    rlbl

                    Fair, but for all the previously supported game modes? Rhetorical question, because they do not exist to view them.

                     

                    I think I am wondering: Would there be justification to support ALL the games the entire HC community would want to see:

                    - would any show low numbers

                    - would some people switch from CORE to HC (that answer is an obvious yes, but how many... and would that number be enough to justify them)

                     

                    That is my question angle I think...  I wish they were all there, but I submit to the idea that it may not make sense, no matter what my feelings on the subject are.  I felt totally abandoned when they dropped support in BO1, and even though I did not like it nor did I like what they did (bombs and flags), I understood why they did it in principal (and still hated it)

                    • 27. Re: 4 HC modes at launch...
                      rankismet

                      rlbl wrote:

                       

                      Fair, but for all the previously supported game modes? Rhetorical question, because they do not exist to view them.

                       

                      I think I am wondering: Would there be justification to support ALL the games the entire HC community would want to see:

                      - would any show low numbers

                      - would some people switch from CORE to HC (that answer is an obvious yes, but how many... and would that number be enough to justify them)

                       

                      That is my question angle I think...  I wish they were all there, but I submit to the idea that it may not make sense, no matter what my feelings on the subject are.  I felt totally abandoned when they dropped support in BO1, and even though I did not like it nor did I like what they did (bombs and flags), I understood why they did it in principal (and still hated it)

                       

                      I was pretty involved in the Bombs/Flags fiasco of BO1. It was a great compromise... the HC community got more modes. TA kept the community from fragmenting.

                       

                      And then people whined like stuck pigs.

                       

                      Ideal world... all modes would be there. Reality-ville... there aren't enough HC players for all of them.

                       

                      ... but...

                       

                      ... there aren't enough for some of the Core modes either.

                      • 28. Re: 4 HC modes at launch...
                        WKMMS

                        I'm no fan of Search myself either, but I don't see why they couldn't, as Maccabi suggested, have some mosh pit modes so HC players have at least some chance to experience all of the modes in a HC setting.  I tweeted something similar to Vahn, after but it fell on deaf ears.

                        • 29. Re: 4 HC modes at launch...
                          IronSight8

                          WOW! Are the Devs that disconnected w/ HC that they take away one of our MAIN gametypes? If anything I was expecting to see Search and Rescue added in addition to the S&D. I hope this is not confirmed and just rumors.

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