16 Replies Latest reply: Jan 24, 2014 12:49 PM by nicedrewishfela RSS

    Trying to make apples out of oranges

    ghamorra

      As each day passes there are numerous threads added to the forums about players who want to make changes to things that don't need changed. Most often it's players who are trying to take a weapon that's designed for a specific role and make it more universal or give it properties that don't fit it's intended use. Whenever you're dealing with the public you're going to have those who just don't understand. They can see an orange and fully expect it be an apple. Working the first 6 years of my working life in retail, electronics retail of all things, I know that some folks just don't get it.

       

      So instead of trying to fix stupid I just want to offer some advice.

       

      The talented men and women who made this game are professionals. They've been producing this franchise for nearly a decade and, this is not an insult, have pretty much made the same game since the beginning. They know what they're doing. They have facts and stats to prove they know what they're doing. If something doesn't work the way you expect it to your expectations are most likely unrealistic.

       

      What I'm talking about are those who feel Riot Shields should be weapons that kill easily. Pointstreaks are meant for killwhores. Sniper rifles are close range weapons. A heavily armored, death machine wielding, assailant should move like a ordinary soldier. The list goes on.

       

      Everything in this game has a purpose and it was designed to execute accordingly. Requesting a buff or nerf should not be premised around a desire to utilize whatever it is for something other than it's designed purpose.

       

      It's also important to separate a mechanical flaw from a functionality flaw. Something that is mechanically failing isn't underpowered. It's just "broken" per se. For instance, asking the Riot Shield to be buffed because it's failing to stop bullets coming from in front of you isn't a valid solution. If the Riot Shield receives a buff and it then functions as it should you now have a item that's overpowered. Now if you have a sniper that bolt-action, has high recoil, but very low damage requiring a minimum of two shots to kill then we have a functionality flaw. The sniper is not designed to function as it should.

       

      Another thing that should be considered is that not every part of the game is always usable. Would you call in a Helicopter on Sovereign? Probably not. On a map like Sovereign it would be best to use Support of Specialist rather than Assault as it would serve a more useful purpose. Sure you might have one or two games where airsupport has some success, but generally speaking it's not something you should expect. The same can be said for using a Marksmen Rifle on a tight map. MRs don't have a versatility to handle maps without range or long lines of sight. It would be best to go with a fast firing short range weapon.

       

      When discussing the effectiveness of something you must understand that which you are discussing.

        • Re: Trying to make apples out of oranges
          iHattoriHanzo0

          "Hi, I'm riot shield"..........................."Hey, I'm not riot shield"

          images-11.jpeg

          • Re: Trying to make apples out of oranges
            adw1983
            Now if you have a sniper that bolt-action, has high recoil, but very low damage requiring a minimum of two shots to kill then we have a functionality flaw. The sniper is not designed to function as it should.

             

            But aren't the developers professionals who knows what they're doing, and would their choice to make a two hit kill sniper rifle automatically be fine by that logic?

            • Re: Trying to make apples out of oranges
              Gerbera

              QFE.

               

              That's something I've tried to tell people multiple times now; sometimes it can come down to nothing more than the map in terms of how effective something might be. Like the Battle Hind, for example. I see people complain it's not getting them SO many kills...only to find out that they're using it on a map like Sovereign or Chasm or some map that gives players A LOT more overhead cover rather than more open maps like Stonehaven, Stormfront, Siege, Overlord, Warhawk, etc.

               

              Or people trying to run around/chase down enemies around the entire map of a larger map as a Juggernaut (Recon) rather than sticking to a portion of the map. I find the Juggernauts and Maniacs should be used the opposite of what I see people tend to do; Juggernauts for the smaller maps and the Maniac for larger maps. I see people tend to use the Maniac on smaller maps because they believe they'll get more kills in a lesser amount of time, which can happen, but it also greatly increases the chances of you running into 2+ enemies at the same time who can double team you and kill you faster before you can get so many kills and, obviously, even if you can take one of them down, you leave yourself unable to move for a second or two due to the knifing animation, plus the smaller and more simplistic maps means there's not many ways to outflank people..On larger maps, you'll have a better chance of encountering enemies one on one and off-guard while having various pathways to take to outflank and, with your speed, it's not like it would take long either.

               

              People  also seem to get it in their head that (almost) everything should work just as well as everything else on every map with every playstyle (usually because they have more trouble using something compared to someone else who destroys them with that same thing). Rather than extensively experiment with different playstyles with different loadouts on different maps, many people seem to only try things out once and if it doesn't work "perfectly" for them, it must not work ever; all or nothing.

               

              It's probably why, from my experience, that LMGs tend to get a lot of unfounded hate ever since the beginning; those people expecting LMGs to be just as viable run and gun weapons as ARs, SMGs, and shotguns rather than what they're purpose is; longer-range, supporting/suppressive/defensive fire from less mobile positions (but still able to move to new positions fast enough if need be). But if they slap on the Speed Perks/Attachments and go charging around banzai-style and don't so well, well that must mean LMGs suck period (of course, some people who know what they're doing CAN actually do decently running and gunning with LMGs).

                • Re: Trying to make apples out of oranges
                  ghamorra

                  There's a lot of, what I find at least, illogical complaints about juggernauts that I just don't understand. People want them to be something they're not. You don't make a guy carrying over 100+ pounds of equipment a swift moving soldier. That just doesn't make sense.

                   

                  We saw what Black Ops II turned into. A lot of hate was shared across the board and most of that stemmed from components of the game that were suggested but those banned together as selfish individuals to preach their discontent. What people need to do and think long and hard about why something is the way it is or isn't the way it is.

                    • Re: Trying to make apples out of oranges
                      nicedrewishfela

                      I don't use the Juggs often, I am not much of a long killstreak guy. But been really playing well lately and gotten a few Maniacs, two on Strikezone. The first one I got (This is HC TDM, btw) I dropped outside the Pro Shop. My error, however, was not checking my surroundings well enough. As Soon as I put the suit on, a guy came through the Pro Shop and lit me up. I hadn't gone 3 feet before I got dropped.

                       

                      Flash to this morning, Strikezone again. Was fortunate enough to get a quick streak going towards the beginning of the game (We spawned Bar, other team was trying desperately.. and poorly.. to hold the bottom spawn. Flanked down around the Hot Dog stand, took out a few enemies. Scanned the steps, no Tangos, took out a guy sitting on the Skywalk, then looked into the Pro Shop and took out one more. This time I was patient. I waited until teammates spawned all around me. As they spread out, I threw the maniac and waited. Was able to get it and moved back behind the boxes just as the enemy came through Pro Shop again Took a few shots but was able to get close enough to get two quick stabs. Went on a nice streak with the Maniac by skulking around the perimeter of the maps, which is not easy in Hardcore as the Maniac doesn't take much to kill.

                       

                      I have found that 99% of the time I am able to correct my own complaints by simply re-thinking my approach and adapting to the situation. It amazes me how people in this game refuse to do that.

                    • Re: Trying to make apples out of oranges
                      nuttin2say

                      "Yes, I'd like to get a square peg for that round hole, please."

                    • Re: Trying to make apples out of oranges
                      Ss78_

                      Ah well we're only human after all and that's what makes life fun.

                       

                      • Re: Trying to make apples out of oranges
                        Highwayman0226

                             I get the point of your post, I really do, but...  Isn't the riot shield supposed to block bullets coming from the front of you?  Isn't it pretty useless if people can shoot right through it?  You are better off staying behind a rock with a gun than walking around with a piece of cardboard.  The shield worked well in MW3.  BO2 I used it once, kept getting killed from the front, put it on the shelf.

                        • Re: Trying to make apples out of oranges
                          nicedrewishfela

                          Me? I prefer Bananas.

                          • Re: Trying to make apples out of oranges

                            Good post Ghamorra. I'm a FPS noob trying to find strategic insight in this forum. Mainly what I've found is whining, but there is some good stuff. Your posts on camping were great.