Possibility to include a new statistic in Call Of Duty? What does the community/Activision think?

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Re: Possibility to include a new statistic in Call Of Duty? What does the community/Activision think?

in reply to Yppecaye_the_Dogged

I thought about including WLR, that way it tracks your individual contribution to the game and it is not dependent on your teammates....because EVERYONE GETS THE BEST TEAMMATES

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Re: Possibility to include a new statistic in Call Of Duty? What does the community/Activision think?

in reply to TheAscendantOne

Excellent thread.  5 stars for originality and substance.

The only adjustment I would make is the camper that goes 12-4 and scored 350 or so in your GIN.  There ought to be a minimum number of kills before they can enjoy scoring good GIN.  For example, they have to have scored 15 or more kills with a KD of higher than 2 to even be considered for GIN.  A 12-1 is rare.  Usually, the unskilled camper, if they do well, goes 5-1 and that's no impact at all except for 75-74 games.

BTW try to ignore some of the forum regulars.  I don't remember when's the last time some of these guys took the time and effort (like you did) to try to contribute rather than persistently naysay.  (not you, nut.)

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Re: Possibility to include a new statistic in Call Of Duty? What does the community/Activision think?

in reply to TheAscendantOne

@ ascendant ...

If you truly wanted to create something that truly indicated overall player skill, what I would suggest is a stat that applied to individual lobbies. It would not be maintained longer than player stayed in the lobby and, in fact, would change from match to match, depending upon who entered or exited the lobby.

You would calculate this by comparing every player in the lobby to every other player in the lobby. It would involve multiple stats and data. I would hope to get a measure of more than the following, but just using some stats as an example ...

KDR, overall score, SPM, career kills, total time played in mode type, total time played, prestige level, intra-prestige level, total matches played, total wins, WLR ... and more.

Rank each player in the lobby for each of those stats. In other words, rank each player for KDR with the highest kdr getting a 1 and the worst getting a 12. Now do the same thing for every other stat. For example, most time played would be a 1 and the least time played would be a 12.

Once you have the ranking for each player in each category, add up the rank positions of each individual player. For example, let's say Player A was # 1 in every category and there are 10 categories. That player would have 10 "points." Player B is the worst in every category of the same 10 categories so his points would be 120.

This ranking would happen before every match. As you can see, if the lobby keeps all 12 members match after match, there would not be much frequency in a player appearing to have improved. It would happen, but not a lot unless the players in the lobby changed out a lot. Looking at SPM, KDR, etc, would not matter because this inta-lobby ranking would reflect all of those things.

And then you could actually see how the teams are balanced out. If the top six players are consistently on the same team, then you could see why some players would back out. However, if the odd ranked members were on one team and the even ranked members were on the other, one could actually argue that the teams were balanced and we could get an honest reflection of personal performance - regardless of the stats.

"At the end of the match, there remains only ... nuttin 2 say."
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Re: Possibility to include a new statistic in Call Of Duty? What does the community/Activision think?

in reply to nuttin2say

I completely understand what you are saying Nuttin, there are already advanced algorithms for calculating ranks of players, I know there are some even in MW2, because my team always gets the lowest level player in the lobby when my team has an open spot which is not one of my friends. I am not looking to create a super complicated ranking system, I was just proposing a more convenient way to display a players impact to a game, that takes into account both KDR and SPM.

Sure you can still have them both and you ask what is the point? It is the fact that you have an EXACT number as a point of reference against another player, instead of using "Hes good" or "Hes really good" those words are replaced by "His GIN is 310" and "This guy has a GIN of 500". It is so easy to incorporate since it is simply multiplication and captures the exponential nature of someone with a high KDR and high SPM.

I already said...I think about 5 times in this thread that this is not suppose to even be displayed to the other players in a lobby, but only your friends list, so your whole rant about players trying to capitalize on weaker players by "deceiving" them is irrelevant. I am boggled by how you would even fool people with the GIN....it is a straight multiplication...with a simple concept...BIGGER NUMBER = BETTER. I am positive that even with large majority of mentally challenged kids I have come across in my days of CoD, that they could grasp the concept.

This thread was not written with the intention of proposing a solution to players playing with a team vs players going in alone. Just a better way to look at/view stats and make them more meaningful.

The only reason I brought "teams" into this was to try and show you that this statistic is significant. If you took all the players in a lobby on one team and averaged their GIN to be 350 and the other team to be 200 - there would be an obvious skill differential between teams. I am NOT at all saying you should rank players by this statistic or even include it in the game lobby.

If you want to challenge the way IW does their ranking system, I suggest you start a new thread and do A LOT of research/testing.

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Re: Possibility to include a new statistic in Call Of Duty? What does the community/Activision think?

in reply to TheAscendantOne

TheAscendantOne wrote:



I was just proposing a more convenient way to display a players impact to a game, that takes into account both KDR and SPM.


This I definitely get.

Like I said, your GIN can't be that bad an idea if its principle idea is already in use in league play.

As far as whether it would encourage more quitting/DBing, I don't think so.  As long as there are stats, these guys will always have a reason.  Even without stats, they'll quit/DB. 

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Re: Possibility to include a new statistic in Call Of Duty? What does the community/Activision think?

in reply to TheAscendantOne

id have a KD in the background but not show up at every match. for each gamemode id have it ranked on relevent stats.

TDM: KDspread, this is simply how much more kills you have then deaths. that is what determinds how much you help the team. so a 26K 13D player(KD 2.0) with a 10K 2D player on the other team(assuming the rest of the team is 1KD somehow) the first playaer hasa a KD of 13, the second of 8. the KD of 13 would give a 5 point lead, and thus win the game, so the high spread player helped the game ALOT more. making the 26/13 player the better player.

FFA: avridge place. players will be ranked based on what place they get. lower is better. 1 is best, 8 is worst. say a player get 2nd, 6th, andn 4th. his score would be 4, because that would be his avridge place. good players will likly be around 1.1-2.5 while most players will be around 3.8-6.0. and it tells relevent skill in FFA, next best would be SPM for FFA. KD means nothing in FFA simply becuasae you can win with 40Deaths and 30 kills, you still won the match, even if second place is 20 kills 8 deaths.

objective: relevent SPM, aka kills dont matter. only score that counts is score related directly with the objective, defends/captures/ killing people near the objecive/ ect. any variation of that be used for SPM,

dont even show KD in scoreboards for the gamemode, only show it in their overall stats.

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Re: Possibility to include a new statistic in Call Of Duty? What does the community/Activision think?

in reply to TheAscendantOne

How about we do away with stat tracking all together and just get people to play the game

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Re: Possibility to include a new statistic in Call Of Duty? What does the community/Activision think?

in reply to TheAscendantOne

Actually, the advanced algorithms go back to at least COD4: MW. I know that because I have done a lot of researching and testing.

- That's how I figured out a long time ago how the spawn system worked

- That's how I figured out a long time ago how teams are created

- That's how I figured out a long time ago that the idea of weapons being "overpowered" is purely myth

- and I can go on and on with with things I now based upon running statistical analysis.

- but mainly, that's how I know all one needs to do is take a cursory glance at a player's kdr, wlr, and spm and there will be a strong correlation as to, 1) how the teams will be balanced and 2) the likely outcome of the match.

That does not mean that I back out if I'm going to be on a loser team. What it means is that I have adjust my approach to dealing with the stronger team.

I'll concede, Ascendant, that you're saying the GIN does not have to be publicly displayed. In that case, I could care less whether they implemented it or not. I doubt they would, though, because its more work on the part of the devs calculating something that works for a limited number of players in planning their strategies. Different players, different teams, different clans place different weight on different stats. Not only that, it's too easy for players to run their own analysis. All you have to do is left click on the weapon stats, drag down until they are all covered, right click, select copy, then paste into a spreadsheet. Sure, you've got to clean it up a little, but the hard work of data entry is done.

Far easier to do and with much more information than was available back in MW1, WaW, and MW2 days.

BTW, a different thread would probably be locked since this one already covers the same general idea - a new stat for the game. In any case, I'm not advocating IW or anyone else adopt a new stat. My only point was that while I like your desire to provide a better or more general measure of player performance (not skill because, as I said, "skill" is a subjective measure, not objective), something that accounts for a player's performance in relation to his specific circumstances would be a real improvement, not a shell game (and I don't mean that to be disrespectful) with currently available information.

Yppecaye makes a fair argument for showing back-outs/DBs. I don't know that it would serve any purpose other than an ability to name-and-shame. Whatever. I'm not saying his and Hobs idea is good or bad. What I will say, though, is that if we can accurately measure forfeits, then why can't we also measure the percentage of time people spend playing solo versus in a party?

There might be merit to the GIN idea ... if both forfeits (I call them that because regardless of the reason for leaving the lobby, a loss SHOULD be scored and factored into WLR) and time spent playing in parties or time spent playing solo were also made available.

You do that, then you've got stats that can truly provide an overall view of player effectiveness.

"At the end of the match, there remains only ... nuttin 2 say."
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Re: Possibility to include a new statistic in Call Of Duty? What does the community/Activision think?

in reply to nuttin2say

nuttin2say wrote:



Actually, the advanced algorithms go back to at least COD4: MW. I know that because I have done a lot of researching and testing.



- That's how I figured out a long time ago how the spawn system worked


- That's how I figured out a long time ago how teams are created


- That's how I figured out a long time ago that the idea of weapons being "overpowered" is purely myth


The first three points of "testing and research" have nothing to do with determining ranks of players or game impact, like this thread is based on. I am not proposing to redefine the ranking system of any CoD game, just implement new more meaningful stats.

I DEFINITELY agree with you that there should be a games completed vs. games played stat.

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Re: Possibility to include a new statistic in Call Of Duty? What does the community/Activision think?

in reply to nuttin2say

nuttin2say wrote:



My only point was that while I like your desire to provide a better or more general measure of player performance (not skill because, as I said, "skill" is a subjective measure, not objective), something that accounts for a player's performance in relation to his specific circumstances would be a real improvement, not a shell game (and I don't mean that to be disrespectful) with currently available information.




You do that, then you've got stats that can truly provide an overall view of player effectiveness.


The GIN statistic would be an attempt to QUANTIFY a players SKILL and take it from the land of subjectivity (I.e. "Hes bad" or "He's good" and put it into objectivity (i.e. "He has a GIN of 65" and "He has a GIN of 600") by calculating a number! That is the whole point of why this would be useful...

Also, yes I know how to use spreadsheets...quite well, I make them everyday at work, but since this is straight multiplication a coding genius for IW could write this into the game in a couple hours...not hard and not that much work. The real predicament is how it would affect the dynamics of a lobby and if to make it visible to players in a lobby. Most people here, and myself agree that it should not be.

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