MW3 Weapon/Poinstreak/Perk Balance Community Feedback thread

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MW3 Weapon/Poinstreak/Perk Balance Community Feedback thread

Alright, so I did one of these threads a while ago, but gave up because the devs didn't care and nobody important was reading the feedback.  Now all of the sudden in the last 2 months it seems like the IW devs care again and Mark Rubin has said multiple times that within the next few weeks they will be doing a weapons and pointstreaks "sweep" - meaning they are going to be tweaking/rebalancing many weapons and pointstreaks.  I'd like to trust them in coming up with truly balanced weapon stats but I can't after MW2's weapon balance and the way MW3's weapon balance still is right now, because I have no idea how any dev ever thought the MP7, ACR 6.8, or Type 95 were at all balanced in any way.  So let's get our community feedback in to help them.  Post your suggestions in this thread about what guns you think are either overpowered or underpowered and include your suggestion for how to make the gun balance, and most importantly state your REASON for why you think your suggested changes would make the gun balanced.  Don't just say "X is OP, because I said so.  Fix it."  Nobody will listen to you.  Don't forget to also tweet your weapon balance suggestions to @IWMarkRubin, @Teanah, and @Candyslexia.

I've played FPS games for a very long time and I have a very good sense for balance. I often realize that certain things are OP/UP a while before the broader community realizes it and starts begging for nerfs/buffs.  When I take one look at the weapon stats and say "X is going to get nerfed," chances are it really will get nerfed somewhere down the road. I've studied every stat there is to study in MW3 and I know all the numbers behind every gun, perk, and poinstreak like the back of my hand. So I've taken the time to write up a MW3 weapon balance draft, and I've put a ton of thought into it.  Here it is:

Assault Rifles:

M4A1: Increase range from 800-1400 to 1000-1500.  This makes it more competitive with the SCAR-L.

SCAR-L: No change.

CM901: Increase min damage to 30 (for hardcore), increase range from 800-1900 to 1000-1900.

AK-47: Increase min damage to 30.

G36C: No change.

ACR 6.8:  Reduce mag size from 30 to 20.  Change damage from 45-30 to 35-25 (increase headshot multiplier to 1.5x to retain 2 headshot kill).

  • The ACR is currently the most dominant assault rifle, clearly outclassing all others except the Type 95, which is why it needs so many changes.  Currently it takes the exact same number of bullets to kill as the CM901 and AK-47 (3-4) while ALSO having much less recoil, a higher fire rate, and faster reload, and having almost the same 3-hit-kill range.  With the new damage, it will still take 3-4 shots but have a slightly smaller 3-hit-kill range.  A 20 round mag will make it fit the role of the MW2 SCAR-H: a powerful, low recoil/long range weapon balanced with a moderate fire rate and small magazine.  It will also no longer be a 1 shot kill at all ranges in hardcore, leaving that as a special trait to the AK-47, CM901, and unsilenced M16A4.

Type 95 option 1: Reduce max damage to 50, change range from 800-2000 to 500-2000 and reduce fire rate to 925 rpm.  Also increase hip-fire spread from 4 - 7 to 5 - 7.  This retains the 2 shot kill potential but the 2 hit kill range is much shorter, and it is no longer a make-shift shotgun with the hip-fire spread.

Type 95 option 2: Change damage from 55-20 to 49-25 with 800-1500 range and 925 rpm fire rate. Also increase hip-fire spread from 4 - 7 to 5 - 7.

* Type 95 is a tough one to balance.  Not sure either of these suggestions are that great, but the bottom line is that the Type 95 needs some sort of nerf.

M16A4: Change damage to a flat 34 across all ranges.  Give the silenced version 34-25 damage with 1000-2000 range (these would be the actual ranges when silenced, not pre-modified ranges).

Mk14: Slightly increase vertical recoil.

FAD: Increase range from 800 - 1000 to 1100 - 1300.

SMGs:

MP5: Reduce horizontal recoil to 65 left, 55 right.

UMP45: No change.

PP90M1: Increase horizontal recoil to 75 each direction, increase vertical recoil to 65 also.  Decrease center speed to 1550.  Normalize rapid fire effect to 25% like other SMGs.  Keeps it still extremely dominant in close range, but difficult to use at mid-long range.

P90: No change.

PM-9: Reduce visual recoil (not viewkick). Reduce reload time to 1.8 seconds.  Keep rapid fire effect at 33%.  Possibly improve hip-fire from 3 - 5 to 2.5 - 4.5 (may be a bit much).

MP7: Reduce min damage from 20 to 17, slightly increase vertical recoil from 45 to 50.

LMGs:

L86 LSW: Reduce min damage from 38 to 30.  It took 1 more bullet at long range than any other LMG pre-patch, it should be the same post-patch to make sure the MG36 and MK46 are still useful.

All other LMGs: No change.

Machine Pistols:

FMG9: Reduce damage from 40-20 to 30-17.  It currently makes the other 3 machine pistols pointless, having the best damage profile, highest RPM, and largest magazine.

MP9: No change.

Skorpion: Reduce vertical recoil 15-20%.

G18: Increase min damage from 17 to 20.

All machine pistols: Akimbo should GREATLY increase the hip-fire spread on ALL of them, similar to PP2000 akimbo hip-fire in MW2.

Shotguns:

USAS-12: No change.

AA-12: Increase damage per pellet to 17-8.  Increase starting ammo.

Spas-12: Increase damage per pellet to 35-15.

Model 1887: Increase damage per pellet to 40-20.

Striker: Reduce fire rate to 300 rpm.

KSG-12: No change.

Perks:

Extreme conditioning: 3x sprint instead of 2x.

Scavenger: always replenish tactical grenades, lethal thrown grenades, and anti-air launchers

Blast Shield: Increase explosive resistance from 0.55x to 0.35x.

Assassin: Remove immunities to CUAV and EMP (move those over to Blind Eye Pro) and enable Marksman PRO to see red names above Assassin Pro users.

Pointstreaks:

Stealth Bomber: Decrease blast radius and damage of bombs

Strafe Run:  Give all 5 helicopters 1 or 2 flares each, but all 5 should dump flares at the same time (only burns 1 or 2 rockets total).

Reaper: Decrease number of missiles to 10.

Attack Helicopter:  Give it 1 flare.

Pavelow: Add one more flare.

Recon Juggernaut: Decrease total health.

Care package: Remove Osprey Gunner and Assault Juggernaut.

EMP: Reduce duration to 30 sec.

Ballistic Vests: Lower the health provided in HC modes to something more proportional to starting health.

Emergency Airdrop: Should not drop EMPs or Recon Juggernauts

Osprey Gunner: Needs at least 1 more flare, if not 2 more.

Equipment:

Frag grenades: Increase blast radius and also slightly increase maximum damage to create a bigger lethal range

*more to come in this section


I encourage you to leave your own feedback below, but if you don't know the numbers and statistics and variables behind the weapons in MW3 I highly suggest you take a look at the stats and learn them for yourself first so that you can craft better suggestions for the developers.  You can find more statistics than you know what to do with here: http://symthic.com/mw3charts.php and http://denkirson.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=general&action=display&thread=3235. If you actually talk about very specific adjustments to specific variables like I did in my draft, they are more likely to listen to you.  If you think any of my suggestions are too extreme, feel free to say so and if anyone has better ideas than mine (specifically the Type 95) I will updated the OP with your suggestion and give you credit for it.  Also, if you have any questions about any gun, perk, or pointstreak, just ask me.  I bet you anything I know the answer.

I will be moderating this thread and updating it daily.  ALL posts must obey the following rules, and any that don't will be reported:

1. Debate is okay, starting a flame war isn't.  If you disagree with someone, then you can state your disagreement in a mature, respectful, and intelligent manner.  Anything along the lines of "No, this gun is fine and shouldn't be nerfed because you just suck and you need to get better and stop crying" will be reported without question.  You think someone has a bad suggestion? Come back with a better suggestion, referencing the real weapon statistics (not the ones you pull out of your arse) and explaining WHY you believe your suggested changes to the weapon's statistics make better sense.  Got it?  If you don't, too bad.

2.  Leave skill OUT of the debate.  Skill has NOTHING to do with weapon balance. At all.  If you think it does, you don't even understand the concept of weapon balance in the first place.  Weapons are balanced in an attempted to make your score accurately represent your skill level, not make up for your lack of it.  Two players with the same skill level playing with the same play style should not have drastically different scores because one of them uses an ACR and the other uses an M4A1.  Guns should be statistically equivalent with each other so that a player can choose essentially any weapon in the game and get about the same score, with the only thing affecting his score being his skill level, not his gun selection.  If one gun is always the superior choice because it gives you better scores, what is the point of having any of the others in the game at all?

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42 REPLIES

Re: MW3 Weapon/Poinstreak/Perk Balance Community Feedback thread

in reply to iamhollywood5

For the name showing for assassin you should have marksman pro for the name to show. There is my 2 cents

Level 3
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Re: MW3 Weapon/Poinstreak/Perk Balance Community Feedback thread

in reply to iamhollywood5

Assassin is and always will be the most contested point. I would like to see reduced recoil for the skorpion and g18, I don't really see the point of increasing the reaper by 1 point, its fine at 9.

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Re: MW3 Weapon/Poinstreak/Perk Balance Community Feedback thread

in reply to iamhollywood5

The pm9 would be the new top smg if recoil was reduced.

I don't think shotguns need more damage and definatley a no to improving the sprint speed.

A shotgunner with extreme conditioning on is pretty beast at the moment I couldn't handle them getting more faster and powerful.

The type 95 is ok as it is

The acr just needs more recoil a smaller clip won't stop people using. It will just be extended mags silencer combo.

Scavenger what you said sounds good but if it replenishes tactical then blast shield needs to block flash bangs more.

I use scavenger on all my classes and would love to be spamming flash bangs lol but they are very powerful.

I think stealth bomber, remote sentry, juggernaut, and osprey should be moved to assault or deleted.

Uav cuav should be moved to support. Uav should start at 6 points. These are free streaks so they shouldn't be so easy. It will stop spy plane spamming. Also make it so you either have uav or cuav equipped.

No points should be gained for taking out air support.

Osprey gunner should have 4 flares

The support stuff needs to peak higher say 25 kills for the highest think. Highest streak should be the emp.

Leave the reaper at 8 it's quite map dependent

Level 8
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Re: MW3 Weapon/Poinstreak/Perk Balance Community Feedback thread

in reply to iamhollywood5

Sorry leave reaper at 9

I want it to be clear that no support will gain a player an actual kill. So players need to choose to either have uavs cuavs Sam turrets emp recon drone ect or go the assault package way but not have access to the uavs

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Re: MW3 Weapon/Poinstreak/Perk Balance Community Feedback thread

in reply to Screwyounoob

I dont think they are going to move/delete any killstreaks (certainly not delete). There is nothing wrong with Escort Airdrop being in support,  Blind Eye renders EA completely useless, its a 100% counter to it. 4 flares is excessive, 2 is fine, not to mention there is no counter to someone using Blind Eye Pro with an LMG. Support Juggernaut is pretty meh, its fine as well.

I would like to see Ballistic Vests nerfed in some way because they are really abused in HC, and a reduction of EMP duration to 30 secs. A stealth bomber nerf would be nice, although it probably wouldn't even be noticed in HC.

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Re: MW3 Weapon/Poinstreak/Perk Balance Community Feedback thread

in reply to NoLifeKing231

I ment 4 flares for the osprey gunner the assault one.

The stealth bomber shouldn't be in assault.

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Re: MW3 Weapon/Poinstreak/Perk Balance Community Feedback thread

in reply to iamhollywood5

Updated the OP with some feedback.

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Re: MW3 Weapon/Poinstreak/Perk Balance Community Feedback thread

in reply to iamhollywood5

not sure why you are beating up the reaper, it really is fine. It shines on certain maps, and it downright sucks on others. It has a flare, its hard to shoot down with bullets unless you're directly underneath it, its balanced. I'm also worried about the effect a reduced recoil to the PM-9 would have on the entire game, it would all of a sudden be a faster shooting mp7.

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Re: MW3 Weapon/Poinstreak/Perk Balance Community Feedback thread

in reply to NoLifeKing231

"It has a flare, its hard to shoot down with bullets" - exactly.  That, combined with 14 deadly missles for only a 9 pointstreak, is a little bit much, and makse the Strafe Run and AH-6 kinda obsolete.  It just needs a little nerf in some way, whether that be less rockets or taking away its flare.

As for the PM-9, it has the highest recoil of any primary gun in the whole game (excluding Rapid Fire LMGs).  And I'm not talking about a huge recoil reduction, just a moderate one to make it useable.  It has two different kinds of recoil, combined.  1. Viewkick (your whole screen/point-of-view bouncing aorund) and 2. Gunkick (the gun itself jumping around your screen).  I'm only talking about reducing Gunkick and leaving Viewkick alone, so you can actually see what you are aiming it.  It would still be the highest recoil SMG.

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