17 Replies Latest reply: May 2, 2011 3:53 PM by dedicatedserversplease RSS

    Possible Weapon Tweaks/Balance

      Hi Everyone,

      I thought I might visit some thoughts I have had while I play Black Ops in the evenings. While I do feel there are some weapons that dominate in areas they should not be dominating, I feel overall the weapons are balanced out pretty well. As I have seen from firsthand accounts now on the Xbox, the snipers were tuned and now are a force in CQC as well.  I would like to get your opinions on a couple things that I have been thinking about in regards to further balancing two weapon tiers, the AR's and the SMG's with a brief touch on the snipers.

      I will preface this list stating I am a long time COD player, been playing since the first COD was released back in 2003. I am more of a purist.

      Below I will list a few weapons and what I feel should be added/removed from them in order to balance them out a bit, starting with the hottest topic, the Famas.

      1. Famas- Other high powered weapons with high fire rates such as the Skorpion are balanced by giving it a lower clip size while the Famas reaps the benefit of a larger clip size. How to balance it? Make it on par with other high rate high power weapons, reduce the clip size to 20. If you say that is not feasible, then its hip fire accuracy needs reducing with the addition of idle sway.

      2. AK74U- This is a gun that I feel is NOT overpowered but instead overused as it dominates in all areas. One of the main reasons it dominates all over is due to the grip. I am not a fan of this weapon as it is seen everywhere. My suggestion would be to remove the grip attachment entirely and give it to my next gun.

      3.MP5K- Give this gun the option of grip, as this weapon has more "unpredictable" recoil when compared to the AK74U. Also why does this gun have a bullet drop off.  If trying to single fire across the map, you do not obtain a hitmarker thus making this one of the few guns with an actual distance threshold (at least based on my experience using it).

      4. PM63- Why on earth was this weapon not given a silencer? I really enjoy this weapon but dual weild is useless and it would be quite a force if a silencer were allowed on it. It is already gimped with a 20rd mag needing ext mags to make it viable, at least let us equip a silencer to give it some more benefit.

      5. Aug- Once again high fire rate, high power. I do not understand why high fire rate high power SMG's such as the Skorpion, Mac-11 and Kiparis are crippled by clips of 20, yet their more effective counterparts have larger clips and are extremely accurate hipfired in CQC negating all SMG's. Reduce clip size to 20 or reduce hip fire accuracy and add idle sway.

      6. Hip Fire Accuracy- AR's should not be so accurate being hip fired without Steady Aim. There is no way a user with MPL Rapid Fire should lose a CQC battle when he is aimed in to a user using a Galil Silenced who is hip firing in return. It happens often enough that the hip fire problem is a nuisance. If users want to hip fire, use a SMG. AR's are TOO all around in this game, they should be gimped in CQC the same way most of the SMG's are in medium to long range.

      7. Knife- The knife in this game is still way too utilized for this being a FPS. WIth ballistic knife equipped, the lunge is ridiculous, to the level of Commando in MW2 (oftentimes the knifer can be several feet away from you and still get the kill even though they werent close to you). My suggestion is to completely remove the lunge and completely remove the auto lock on. This would require the knife to be use stealthily and tactifully instead of a crutch for bad players or those who panic knife(yes it occurs Vahn, I even panic knife at times and am ashamed).

      8. Anti Lag- The anti lag in this game has been inconsistent and makes for some bad gaming. It really hampers the host to the point to where I upload/download things on my laptop to ensure I am not chosen as the host. I have a 65/15Mbps download/upload speed internet tier and I have never felt a game run so poorly on a good connection as this one has. Also the Matrix style bullets are getting a bit old. . The next COD needs to implement dedicated servers to get rid of all this inconsistent B.S. Dedicated servers will at least give us 1 thing, CONSISTENCY.

      9. Tomahawk- I know everyone loves to throw the tomahawk, but really(This includes you Buck)? By that I mean, the tomahawk can really bounce 5-6 times be almost completely stopped, tap your toe and you die? MW2 had it right with the throwing knife(probably one of the few things MW2 had right), you can bank shot but it cannot roll. The tomahawk should get implanted in the ground on those cross the map throws. Treyarch doesnt allow you to Noob Tube, Grenade Spam the spawn in SnD, but now it rains Tomahawks. Either remove the ridiculous rolling to make it a bit more of a challenge, or apply the 10 second delay at the start of the round.


      Here is my last one, I know alot of you will probably wet your pants when you read this. I am giving you a warning. If you cannot be mature and handle what I say next, please do not reply.

      10. Quickscoping- I feel that quickscoping is much too easy now. Not only that, hipfiring is much too accurate and easy as well. I enjoyed snipers when they were slightly more difficult to use. It was a challenge to run around a map with a sniper in your hands. When I moved locations, I HAD to pull out my secondary as it should be. Now....I can just run around and quickscope EASILY. I know alot of you will say it is not that easy, well when you figure it out, its simple.


      These are all my opinions and I am sure ALOT of you will not agree with me. I am merely stating what I believe would improve MY experience and what I believe would make this a more balanced/competitive product.  I am by no means saying this is what "everyone" thinks or believes. I look forward to hearing your replies but ask that you be mature and give some intelligent responses.
        • Re: Possible Weapon Tweaks/Balance
          chris251922
          tbh i am getting very tired of people trying to get the game changed to there specificaions. there are more than you that play this game and there are many that like the weapons as they are. play hardcore and weapon power doesnt come into it. just learn to have fun and not critisize everything.
          • Re: Possible Weapon Tweaks/Balance

            chris251922 wrote:

             

            tbh i am getting very tired of people trying to get the game changed to there specificaions. there are more than you that play this game and there are many that like the weapons as they are. play hardcore and weapon power doesnt come into it. just learn to have fun and not critisize everything.


            Thanks for your input Chris.  As I have said, this is my opinion and the forums are for discussions which is what I am trying to take part in. You do not see me crying or whining, merely stating my observations. I dont play hardcore because I do not like it.  I wont go into my reasons as that is an entirely different discussion and would create alot of flaming.  Anyways, have a great night or good morning as I just noticed your flag.
            • Re: Possible Weapon Tweaks/Balance
              TrizzleJizzle
              your post was more constructive then 99% of the others. I will agree with you, mostly because of delivery. What you say does make sense.
              • Re: Possible Weapon Tweaks/Balance

                TrizzleJizzle wrote:

                 

                your post was more constructive then 99% of the others. I will agree with you, mostly because of delivery. What you say does make sense.


                Thanks for the good feedback Trizzle.  The last thing I want is this to be looked at as a "Waaaaa I keep dying by this weapon" type of thread.  I am merely stating what I feel would allow more diversity in weapon selection and more disparity between strengths/weakness of weapons in certain ranges.
                • Re: Possible Weapon Tweaks/Balance
                  so basically most of the game still needs changed? THE GAME IS FINE, man up and play it for God sake, i have no problems with anything you just moaned about, even the QS remark, and everyone on here knows just how much i hate quick scoping lol. It's still very difficult to do, but normal snipers (using the scope) can now get kills easier.
                  • Re: Possible Weapon Tweaks/Balance
                    ^The game doesnt NEED to be changed, I am merely stating what I feel to be the negatives to the game and hoping to invoke an intelligent discussion regarding my viewpoints. Obviously Treyarch feels the need to further tune the game with the snipers, I am just pointing out other areas as well that may require additional fine tuning.   Maybe you just play for fun and are a laid back guy.  I play to be competitive and enjoy a different aspect of online gaming.  Do you see me sitting here telling you to "man up" or "go brush your teeth   " or some other snide remark? Neither am I "moaning," in fact I think I presented a well written piece that sums up MY experience with the game, as I am only speaking for myself.
                    • Re: Possible Weapon Tweaks/Balance

                      dedicatedserversplease wrote:

                       

                      ^The game doesnt NEED to be changed, I am merely stating what I feel to be the negatives to the game and hoping to invoke an intelligent discussion regarding my viewpoints. Obviously Treyarch feels the need to further tune the game with the snipers, I am just pointing out other areas as well that may require additional fine tuning.   Maybe you just play for fun and are a laid back guy.  I play to be competitive and enjoy a different aspect of online gaming.  Do you see me sitting here telling you to "man up" or "go brush your teeth   " or some other snide remark? Neither am I "moaning," in fact I think I presented a well written piece that sums up MY experience with the game, as I am only speaking for myself.




                      Apparently you think the game "Needs" dedicated servers.

                      You are wrong in both cases.

                      But hey, you are entitled to your opinion.
                      • Re: Possible Weapon Tweaks/Balance
                        Is anyone else experiencing deja-vu?
                        • Re: Possible Weapon Tweaks/Balance

                          splittinwigs wrote:

                           

                          dedicatedserversplease wrote:

                           

                          ^The game doesnt NEED to be changed, I am merely stating what I feel to be the negatives to the game and hoping to invoke an intelligent discussion regarding my viewpoints. Obviously Treyarch feels the need to further tune the game with the snipers, I am just pointing out other areas as well that may require additional fine tuning.   Maybe you just play for fun and are a laid back guy.  I play to be competitive and enjoy a different aspect of online gaming.  Do you see me sitting here telling you to "man up" or "go brush your teeth   " or some other snide remark? Neither am I "moaning," in fact I think I presented a well written piece that sums up MY experience with the game, as I am only speaking for myself.




                          Apparently you think the game "Needs" dedicated servers.

                          You are wrong in both cases.

                          But hey, you are entitled to your opinion.


                          I do not feel the game "Needs" dedicated servers, but the game in its current state is not optimal.  The anti lag system isnt all its cracked up to be, especially in this game.  I feel the game would run better on dedicated servers with out an anti lag software which determines who gets what compensation.  This way a person would join a server closest to him in terms of ping and not be required to have "compensation."  Also there would no longer be any sort of host migration or games that ended prematurely.  On top of that the obnoxious knife swipes that hit the air, the bullets that round the corner and the hit registration would all be improved.  That I can say with some certainty.  Thanks for your opinion on the matter

                          P.S. PM63 needs a couple more attachments
                          • Re: Possible Weapon Tweaks/Balance

                            dedicatedserversplease wrote:

                             

                            I do not feel the game "Needs" dedicated servers, but the game in its current state is not optimal.  The anti lag system isnt all its cracked up to be, especially in this game.  I feel the game would run better on dedicated servers with out an anti lag software which determines who gets what compensation.  This way a person would join a server closest to him in terms of ping and not be required to have "compensation."  Also there would no longer be any sort of host migration or games that ended prematurely.  On top of that the obnoxious knife swipes that hit the air, the bullets that round the corner and the hit registration would all be improved.  That I can say with some certainty.  Thanks for your opinion on the matter

                            P.S. PM63 needs a couple more attachments



                            Dedicated servers don't have lag compensation 

                            My ping is 19ms, my next door neighbours ping to the same server is 72ms. We would connect to the same dedicated server, yet there would be nothing to even us out?

                            I think somebody needs to do a little homework on a subject before they make a fool of them selves in public 
                            • Re: Possible Weapon Tweaks/Balance

                              dedicatedserversplease wrote:

                               


                              I do not feel the game "Needs" dedicated servers, but the game in its current state is not optimal.  The anti lag system isnt all its cracked up to be, especially in this game.  I feel the game would run better on dedicated servers with out an anti lag software which determines who gets what compensation.  This way a person would join a server closest to him in terms of ping and not be required to have "compensation."  Also there would no longer be any sort of host migration or games that ended prematurely.  On top of that the obnoxious knife swipes that hit the air, the bullets that round the corner and the hit registration would all be improved.  That I can say with some certainty.  Thanks for your opinion on the matter

                              P.S. PM63 needs a couple more attachments




                              By optimal, you've obviously played Homefront huh?

                              How "optimal" would you say those connections are?

                              Exactly!

                              On topic:
                              The weapons are not going to be "tweaked" or "balanced" any more than they already are.
                              • Re: Possible Weapon Tweaks/Balance
                                ballertoth
                                Like a couple others have mentioned, at least your post wasn't incessant and annoying whining.  You tried to explain your side in a calm manner without name calling or anything.

                                I agree with a lot of stuff, like the knife lunge.  I have had a guy from 20 feet away (while i was shooting him) magically appear in front of me and stab me.  I saved it in my file share, it is actually comical, slow motion shows him sliding, not running, from a long distance.  My friends and I watch it when we are drunk on party chat.  Haha.

                                I have to say the guns should be left as they are though.  This is my opinion.  You mention how the FAMAS and AUG are high power and high fire rate.  They aren't high powered according to the stats.  I also don't find those to be powerful during gameplay.  It takes quite a bit of bullets to kill an enemy.  I switch between the AK47 (not AK74u) and the FAMAS.  I find I need to fire much more bullets with the FAMAS than the AK47, and it should be that way as the 47 is a very powerful AR, while the FAMAS is weaker.

                                I think you make an interesting point about not giving the 74u the grip or adding it to another gun, but I think the power and fire rates of the guns are fair.  Again, thats just my opinion.
                                • Re: Possible Weapon Tweaks/Balance

                                  ballertoth wrote:

                                   

                                  Like a couple others have mentioned, at least your post wasn't incessant and annoying whining.  You tried to explain your side in a calm manner without name calling or anything.

                                  I agree with a lot of stuff, like the knife lunge.  I have had a guy from 20 feet away (while i was shooting him) magically appear in front of me and stab me.  I saved it in my file share, it is actually comical, slow motion shows him sliding, not running, from a long distance.  My friends and I watch it when we are drunk on party chat.  Haha.

                                  I have to say the guns should be left as they are though.  This is my opinion.  You mention how the FAMAS and AUG are high power and high fire rate.  They aren't high powered according to the stats.  I also don't find those to be powerful during gameplay.  It takes quite a bit of bullets to kill an enemy.  I switch between the AK47 (not AK74u) and the FAMAS.  I find I need to fire much more bullets with the FAMAS than the AK47, and it should be that way as the 47 is a very powerful AR, while the FAMAS is weaker.

                                  I think you make an interesting point about not giving the 74u the grip or adding it to another gun, but I think the power and fire rates of the guns are fair.  Again, thats just my opinion.


                                  I can agree with your thoughts on the Famas.  I really have no major issue with the weapons balance really, just trying to made for some conversation.  Although I dislike the small clips for many SMG's and feel this hampers many weapons from being relevant due to the need for more bullets in order to register a kill.
                                  • Re: Possible Weapon Tweaks/Balance

                                    splittinwigs wrote:

                                     

                                    dedicatedserversplease wrote:

                                     


                                    I do not feel the game "Needs" dedicated servers, but the game in its current state is not optimal.  The anti lag system isnt all its cracked up to be, especially in this game.  I feel the game would run better on dedicated servers with out an anti lag software which determines who gets what compensation.  This way a person would join a server closest to him in terms of ping and not be required to have "compensation."  Also there would no longer be any sort of host migration or games that ended prematurely.  On top of that the obnoxious knife swipes that hit the air, the bullets that round the corner and the hit registration would all be improved.  That I can say with some certainty.  Thanks for your opinion on the matter

                                    P.S. PM63 needs a couple more attachments




                                    By optimal, you've obviously played Homefront huh?

                                    How "optimal" would you say those connections are?

                                    Exactly!

                                    On topic:
                                    The weapons are not going to be "tweaked" or "balanced" any more than they already are.


                                    No I never played homefront, but I did play Killzone and that game is horrible except for the latency and bullet registration.  If we combined Killzone's matchmaking and COD's gameplay, we have the best game of all time.  Again just one man's opinion here.  I really enjoy black ops and have it rated either tied for #1 or a close #2 in my all time favorites.  WIth that said, thanks for taking the time to reply.  Hopefully the doors arent closed on the snipers just yet, as restrictions were just relaxed so we still have to be in a wait and see to see how it affects gameplay in the next 30-45 days. 

                                    P.S.  Gimme my silencer on the PM63 
                                    • Re: Possible Weapon Tweaks/Balance
                                      Mark13531
                                      I swear you've already posted this somewhere.
                                      • Re: Possible Weapon Tweaks/Balance

                                        dedicatedserversplease wrote:

                                         


                                        No I never played homefront, but I did play Killzone and that game is horrible except for the latency and bullet registration.  If we combined Killzone's matchmaking and COD's gameplay, we have the best game of all time.  Again just one man's opinion here.  I really enjoy black ops and have it rated either tied for #1 or a close #2 in my all time favorites.  WIth that said, thanks for taking the time to reply.  Hopefully the doors arent closed on the snipers just yet, as restrictions were just relaxed so we still have to be in a wait and see to see how it affects gameplay in the next 30-45 days. 

                                        P.S.  Gimme my silencer on the PM63 




                                        Well they both have dedicates servers and they are garbage, so dedicated servers means about as much to a "good connection" as much as Wiggy wiping his butt in the wrong direction.
                                        • Re: Possible Weapon Tweaks/Balance

                                          splittinwigs wrote:

                                           

                                          dedicatedserversplease wrote:

                                           


                                          No I never played homefront, but I did play Killzone and that game is horrible except for the latency and bullet registration.  If we combined Killzone's matchmaking and COD's gameplay, we have the best game of all time.  Again just one man's opinion here.  I really enjoy black ops and have it rated either tied for #1 or a close #2 in my all time favorites.  WIth that said, thanks for taking the time to reply.  Hopefully the doors arent closed on the snipers just yet, as restrictions were just relaxed so we still have to be in a wait and see to see how it affects gameplay in the next 30-45 days. 

                                          P.S.  Gimme my silencer on the PM63 




                                          Well they both have dedicates servers and they are garbage, so dedicated servers means about as much to a "good connection" as much as Wiggy wiping his butt in the wrong direction.


                                          Like I said, Killzone is a HORRIBLE game.  Can you explain why I experience latency issues when I am host at times.  It feels as though I am behind other players and my first few bullets never register.  Also, the game normally lags regardless of host in the beginning of each round, this is a constant issue.  Most of my gaming friends have gaming connections such as myself.  I have a 65/15Mbps line with 8ms ping to a server 50 miles away.  I know this is just an internet speed test, but I have sufficient enough internet to host 12 players without such latency issues. 

                                          P.S. Wiping direction only matters if you are female, in order to prevent cross-contamination or infection.