44 Replies Latest reply: Dec 27, 2011 2:29 AM by infinitlag RSS

    Can someone explain to me what lag compensation is?

      Title.

        • Re: Can someone explain to me what lag compensation is?

          I'm not sure myself, but I think it is something along these lines. Ok, if there is some guy from Australia using a 10 year old dial up connection and is experiencing ferocious lag on the game. Due to his bad connection the lag compensation will make everyone else in the lobby lag even if he's not host.

           

          Not sure if that's true though. Me thinks it's right, but me nose know. :(

          • Re: Can someone explain to me what lag compensation is?

            I had posted this in nintendon't's thread but here you go anyway. Hope this helps..

             

            https://developer.valvesoftware.com/wiki/Source_Multiplayer_Networking#Lag_compe nsation

            • Re: Can someone explain to me what lag compensation is?
              cwatz

              Just watch this video.  Just by watching the footage youll see the effect of it pretty clearly.

               

              http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wJOpFCCnv0E&list=FLz9OqHBRx_Pn6HSTb6QgxxA&index=2 &feature=plpp_video

              • Re: Can someone explain to me what lag compensation is?
                maccabi

                This applies to cod only.

                 

                ok basic groundwork first.....

                Nutshell, it does NOT handicap players with "good connections" this is a fallacy.

                When you connect to a host/server every player has a ping to that host/server (ping is the time it takes a packet of data to travel from your console/pc to the host and back its measured in ms (1000th's of a sec)

                Due to the fact everyone has a different ping this could be for numerous reasons , the way traffic is routed around the internet, the distance you are from the host/server, how your own network is set up , whether you are on adsl or cable.

                 

                What does NOT effect your ping is how much bandwidth you have, which often misnamed and confused by alot of people as "their speed" as isp love to use that term wrongly when selling their packages. ie 10mb down 1 mb up for example.

                 

                Connections when playing via console are different to those playing via a pc so the following part refers to console play ONLY.

                 

                 

                So when you connect everyone has a different ping, before lag comp was introduced to games the golden rule was whoever had the lowest ping was had the best connection to the game and recieved their updates and sent updates faster than anyone else making them have an advantage.  i wont get all technical shenanigans as im not allowed too and will use very "generalised explaniations so you can understand the concepts easily 

                 

                what lag comp does in the most basic way is start the game then rewind it slightly staggering the point everyone starts, So theorectically everyone is now within a certian range usually around 25ms between all players, this may seem like alot but we are talking about 25/1000th of a second

                 

                There is numerous algorithms and equations working in the background to keep this "effect" in check, where people get confused is one of the side effects is everything looks slightly different on everyone elses screens, this is blatantly apparent when watching killcams or theatre playbacks. If you didnt have lag comp in games you would get "wtf kills" due to the lowest ping wins scenerio, with lag comp you get "wtf kills" when you look back at killcams. This is called playing over the internet nothing will ever remove them.

                 

                You NEED lag comp and input predication especially when you play online via console due to to the way console online play works,

                  • Re: Can someone explain to me what lag compensation is?

                    Well lag compensation doesn't need to be in online play for consoles if the games use dedicated servers, like Battlefield 3.

                    • Re: Can someone explain to me what lag compensation is?

                      Kudos, informative and well put together response.

                      • Re: Can someone explain to me what lag compensation is?

                        In MW2 a 3-4 bar connection meant a near-perfect sync though. Never had any corner lag or wtf situations. The old IW really knew how to code online games. The current IW / SHG not so much. The system is totally broken in this game, even after the 1.06 patch.

                        • Re: Can someone explain to me what lag compensation is?
                          nintendon't

                          maccabi wrote:

                           

                          Nutshell, it does NOT handicap players with "good connections" this is a fallacy.

                          Yes it does, I actually tested it one time. I downloaded a bunch of crap while playing a match and all of a sudden the game became extremely easy, I felt like a god, no one could hit me. All of a sudden the second they stopped, everyone on the other team became an MLG pro with insane reactions times as well as killing me with 1 bullet even though I shot 5-6 into them first.

                           

                          It does handicap good connections and puts the advantage towards players with poor connections.

                           

                          Lag compensation doesn't need to go, it just needs to be fixed. The system on Black Ops Wii was nearly perfect besides a few issues like getting shot around corners. Generally if you shot someone first, they died. On MW3 it seems like complete luck when you get a kill. Why can't MW3 be like Black Ops Wii?

                            • Re: Can someone explain to me what lag compensation is?
                              maccabi

                              nintendon\'t wrote:

                               

                              maccabi wrote:

                               

                              Nutshell, it does NOT handicap players with "good connections" this is a fallacy.

                              Yes it does, I actually tested it one time. I downloaded a bunch of crap while playing a match and all of a sudden the game became extremely easy, I felt like a god, no one could hit me. All of a sudden the second they stopped, everyone on the other team became an MLG pro with insane reactions times as well as killing me with 1 bullet even though I shot 5-6 into them first.

                               

                              It does handicap good connections and puts the advantage towards players with poor connections.

                               

                              Lag compensation doesn't need to go, it just needs to be fixed. The system on Black Ops Wii was nearly perfect besides a few issues like getting shot around corners. Generally if you shot someone first, they died. On MW3 it seems like complete luck when you get a kill. Why can't MW3 be like Black Ops Wii?

                              seriously it doesn't what you did was gimp your connection depending on you platform that can and will get you a console ban, although i doubt it on the wii, all you actuall did was make yourself that 1 bar kid everyone in a lobby complains about as he skipps all over the place, to you the game might be fine to others nope it wasnt.

                               

                              and sorry the arguement i shot first i should win isnt totally dependant on the damage,rof and attachments on a gun

                               

                              read what foxy posted thats basically it nutshelled spot on nothing more needs to be said

                                • Re: Can someone explain to me what lag compensation is?
                                  nintendon't

                                  maccabi wrote:

                                   

                                  seriously it doesn't what you did was gimp your connection depending on you platform that can and will get you a console ban, although i doubt it on the wii, all you actuall did was make yourself that 1 bar kid everyone in a lobby complains about as he skipps all over the place, to you the game might be fine to others nope it wasnt.

                                   

                                   

                                  lolwut? Are you telling me it's against the rules to download stuff while I play? lol It's my damn connection that I paid for and I'll do with it as I please. First off there's no bans on Wii and second its not against the rules to slow your connection while you play. So get your facts straight, bud.

                                   

                                  I know what I saw with my own eyes. 1 bars have the advantage. You can argue what you want to the contrary with stuff you looked up off Wikipedia but you're not gonna change my views on it. Hop on your Wii right now and try what I did and you'll see that the game is easier.

                                    • Re: Can someone explain to me what lag compensation is?
                                      maccabi

                                      nintendon\'t wrote:

                                       

                                      maccabi wrote:

                                       

                                      seriously it doesn't what you did was gimp your connection depending on you platform that can and will get you a console ban, although i doubt it on the wii, all you actuall did was make yourself that 1 bar kid everyone in a lobby complains about as he skipps all over the place, to you the game might be fine to others nope it wasnt.

                                       

                                       

                                      lolwut? Are you telling me it's against the rules to download stuff while I play? lol It's my damn connection that I paid for and I'll do with it as I please. First off there's no bans on Wii and second its not against the rules to slow your connection while you play. So get your facts straight, bud.

                                       

                                       

                                      if you bothered to actually read what i wrote i said some platforms,for example xbl where such practices will get you a ban same way as using a lag switch would.

                                       

                                       

                                      nintendon\'t wrote:

                                       

                                      maccabi wrote:

                                       

                                      seriously it doesn't what you did was gimp your connection depending on you platform that can and will get you a console ban, although i doubt it on the wii, all you actuall did was make yourself that 1 bar kid everyone in a lobby complains about as he skipps all over the place, to you the game might be fine to others nope it wasnt.

                                       

                                       

                                       

                                       

                                      I know what I saw with my own eyes. 1 bars have the advantage. You can argue what you want to the contrary with stuff you looked up off Wikipedia but you're not gonna change my views on it. Hop on your Wii right now and try what I did and you'll see that the game is easier.

                                      Im not argueing im stating facts, its actually you who are arguing due to your own intractable skewed opinions and assumptions, but hey its fine each to their own oh and smallish hardly worth mentioning point i didnt gett my "info" off wiki i actually got it from years of hands on expereince #justsaying

                                        • Re: Can someone explain to me what lag compensation is?

                                          You can do whatever you want within your own network as long as you're not altering the data that goes through and you can prioritize your traffic the way you want. No one has any say in that and it's definately not lag switching. Lol @ "stating facts". You're basically saying that while playing online on your console no one else can use the network for anything else. Obviously that's false.

                                            • Re: Can someone explain to me what lag compensation is?
                                              maccabi

                                              djam wrote:

                                               

                                              You can do whatever you want within your own network as long as you're not altering the data that goes through and you can prioritize your traffic the way you want. No one has any say in that and it's definately not lag switching. Lol @ "stating facts". You're basically saying that while playing online on your console no one else can use the network for anything else. Obviously that's false.

                                              no im saying if someone is stupid enough to come onto a public forum and brag they are nerfing their connection to gain an advantage in game depending on the console platform you will if reported get a ban

                                                • Re: Can someone explain to me what lag compensation is?

                                                  Doesn't matter how you put it, it is not against any rules to have other traffic on your network while you play online.

                                                  • Re: Can someone explain to me what lag compensation is?
                                                    nintendon't

                                                    maccabi wrote:

                                                     

                                                    no im saying if someone is stupid enough to come onto a public forum and brag they are nerfing their connection to gain an advantage in game depending on the console platform you will if reported get a ban

                                                    Also, who's bragging? All I did was test something to prove a point. Lower connections have an advantage. Regardless, like djam said it's not against any rules to have any other traffic on your network while playing.

                                                     

                                                    Even if it was (which it isn't), Treyarch has bigger fish to fry like the guys running around with aimbots/unlimited UAVs.....

                                                • Re: Can someone explain to me what lag compensation is?
                                                  nintendon't

                                                  maccabi wrote:

                                                  Im not argueing im stating facts, its actually you who are arguing due to your own intractable skewed opinions and assumptions, but hey its fine each to their own oh and smallish hardly worth mentioning point i didnt gett my "info" off wiki i actually got it from years of hands on expereince #justsaying

                                                  You're not stating any facts at all. You haven't even played the Wii version so you have absolutely no idea what I'm talking about. You're just pulling stuff out of your ass. If you actually played the WIi version instead of pulling information off google, you would agree with me.

                                                • Re: Can someone explain to me what lag compensation is?

                                                  nintendon\'t wrote:

                                                   

                                                  lolwut? Are you telling me it's against the rules to download stuff while I play? lol It's my damn connection that I paid for and I'll do with it as I please. First off there's no bans on Wii and second its not against the rules to slow your connection while you play. So get your facts straight, bud.

                                                  I thought lagswitching is against the rules... 

                                                    • Re: Can someone explain to me what lag compensation is?

                                                      pukama wrote:

                                                       

                                                      nintendon\'t wrote:

                                                       

                                                      lolwut? Are you telling me it's against the rules to download stuff while I play? lol It's my damn connection that I paid for and I'll do with it as I please. First off there's no bans on Wii and second its not against the rules to slow your connection while you play. So get your facts straight, bud.

                                                      I thought lagswitching is against the rules...

                                                      But was he host? I thought he just slowed his internet down to not get host to prove a point, that 1 bar connections can have an advantage over a host. But one thing is for sure, last night I had some good games for a change, and tonight it was the same old story. This game is more bi polar than Frank Bruno. It needs a tweak..

                                                      • Re: Can someone explain to me what lag compensation is?
                                                        nintendon't

                                                        How is downloading stuff while playing "lag switching"?  I didn't have host when I did it either so the only person it would affect is me.

                                                         

                                                        Lag switching is a completely different thing. That's when you have host and you hit the standby button on your routher/modem to lag the connection for everyone else. All I did was turn on my computer and start some downloads while I was off host.

                                                    • Re: Can someone explain to me what lag compensation is?
                                                      nintendon't

                                                      maccabi wrote:

                                                       

                                                      and sorry the arguement i shot first i should win isnt totally dependant on the damage,rof and attachments on a gun

                                                       

                                                      read what foxy posted thats basically it nutshelled spot on nothing more needs to be said

                                                      So you're telling me that when I shot 5-6 bullets with my AK47 into someone, and they kill me with 1 shot of their G36C, it's because of their attachments? Shut up.

                                                       

                                                      I read what he wrote and he's right.

                                                       

                                                      You need lag compensation in the game, but the problem is that the system in MW3 Wii is very poor at the moment. Right now 1 bars have the advantage and 4 bars are at a disadvantage. I've seen it with my own eyes and most of the people on my allies list with one bar connection have unusually high KDRs compared to their Black Ops/Reflex KDRs. That's not a coincidence.I don't even understand why you're arguing with me. Why wouldn't you want a better lag compensation system?

                                                       

                                                      All Treyarch has to do is make the lag compensation system like the one on Black Ops Wii and the game would be perfect.

                                                      • Re: Can someone explain to me what lag compensation is?

                                                        Ok, being serious here and nothing else, can you explain why this is happening to me and quite a few of my team mates, also given the fact that I play with americans most of the time and i'm from the UK, but we're experiencing the same things. I can be shooting at someone, who is walking up to me in a straight line, and nothing is happening to them, but when they shoot, I die right off the bat. Somebody can appear from around  corner, the split second I notice them, i'm shot, and it seems with precise accuricy. I have the 1 - 2 bar connection and am not getting any of the so called benefit or advantage over the host, or anybody for that matter. But on the odd evening, the game plays as almost normal. So lastnight, I stopped playing MW3 for an hour or so and put in black ops, just to see if my internet is causing the problem. I have 1 - 2 bars, and everything is going well. I'm playing HCTDM, and my scores vary, from 10 - 3 or 16/18 - 5 average with a couple of negatives when playing really good players. Then I put MW3 back in and everything all goes to sh!t again. So I know my internet is playable. Please tell me what you think is/can be the problem?

                                                          • Re: Can someone explain to me what lag compensation is?
                                                            maccabi

                                                            pauly01 wrote:

                                                             

                                                            Ok, being serious here and nothing else, can you explain why this is happening to me and quite a few of my team mates, also given the fact that I play with americans most of the time and i'm from the UK, but we're experiencing the same things.

                                                            ping is based on distance amoung other things.. you know that right? playing in an american lobby of vice versa you are always going to have a high ping ie 2 bar connection.

                                                             

                                                            if you are getting 1-2 bar games in a uk lobby then your own connection has a problem somewhere

                                                    • Re: Can someone explain to me what lag compensation is?

                                                      Reading all this, I think the problem we have is not lag compensation. It were there in games it was all fine. So anything else is srewing the experience, and while we don't know, what exactly it is, we call it the name, anyone else called it.

                                                       

                                                      Besides that, dedicated servers would at least kill host frame drops and improve the experinece, speaking of MoH's 32 player MP.

                                                       

                                                      Since Activision growed to a big one, part wise to the biggest in the industry, it's about time i think, considering CoD is one of the main IPs Activiosn have.

                                                      • Re: Can someone explain to me what lag compensation is?

                                                        When I first got MW3, I always had a good connection, whcich was 3 or 4 bars, and did well in matches. But about 2-3 weeks ago I couldn't get a connection above 1 bar and I am lucky to get a match where I can play the entire thing without disconnecting from the host.