22 Replies Latest reply: May 18, 2013 4:49 PM by deamonomic RSS

    League play issue I would like adressed

    deamonomic

      Hey all. Im one of the competitive junkies who consider pub stomps boring. So I chose to play league. and for the most part it is fantastic. I have had more challenging battles in champions league then I ever did in ALL of MW3. Thing is just about every game I join someone drops. Usually within the first half a second of the game. There needs to be something put into effect to stop this. Super probation maby. Personally I vote for being kicked out of your division. out of 20 or so games a night 18 of them will have players rage quiting. I was actually considering competing for the #1 masters spot in my group as I was rank 10. and then the quiting started. now Im back in the 20's and no longer care. still going to play for the challenge of it. just not the rank anymore.

       

      and its not because of lag. if thats your excuse then SHOO! *grabs broom*

        • Re: League play issue I would like adressed
          FalconR6

          I agree that 5 mins is not enough. However, for proby bans to increase gamers need to be assured that they are not going to get them for host dashboards/ disconnects - that are not their fault. In short - probation needs to be more decisive. I'm not enough of a tech head to know how possible it is for the game to decide on culpability.

          Reason gamers quit in LP:

          Backing out when they see the team make ups.

          Up against parties/clans when a lone wolf.

          Getting beat - and not having the guts to see it through or to try and turn the tables.

          Protection of stats when high kill streaks come in.

          The list goes on (sadly) - its just plain selfishness.

          Does LP need point deductions for leaving ?

           

          I loved the idea of LP coming in to BO2 - it's a shame the implementation just isn't working (low pop the proof). Hindsight makes it easy to point the finger at the devs. Maybe Ghosts will learn and give a better outcome (if they do a LP type playlist).

            • Re: League play issue I would like adressed
              JSlayer211

              These are very important points that you made, but I have said it time and time again, there can be no form of competitive play on a peer to peer connection system. PERIOD. Determining who quit when and how is almost impossible, if not completely impossible. You MUST have dedicated servers for this kind of thing in order to give the correct punishment values for leaving. At that point anyone that leaves a game should loose 500 ladder points. I don't care if you got DC, your power went out, your house was on fire, etc. If it truly was an emergency of any importance then the least of your concerns would be the loss of ladder points and focus on the problem that occurred to make you leave in the first place. Just a simple did not finish setting would catch all of the quitters and deduct their points accordingly. Also, it cannot be the games fault that you were unable to finish the game. I cannot count how many times I got booted from a game (mostly pub matches) that it was completely game related error messages (Game session error etc.) and my friends were still in the game. Parties being split up for no reason whatsoever etc. The game has to function properly and without issues. BO2 does not. The concept was good, the implementation was horrid. Thus LP is just the stepping stone for the next CoD to expand upon should they see fit.

               

              Last night I played a LP match where one of the people left before I even had a chance to select my class (3 seconds). Near the end of the match I noticed I was facing lots of 2v1 matchups and checked the boards, sure enough it was 3v6. Even though I went 23-7, we lost. 2nd on my team was 20-11, 3rd was 7-20. The other team was not that good either, so I was thinking in my head this will be a surefire win lol SIKE!

               

              All things considered, the only answer is to get a consistent six man team. Otherwise be prepared for the quitters. When you are dealing with randoms it typically ends one of two ways, either they quit and leave your short or they go so ridiculously negative that you wish they had left earlier.

              • Re: League play issue I would like adressed
                deamonomic

                actually I disagree on the isnt working part. I think league play will win out in the end. or atleast have a passable player pool. already we have 10 times the numbers we had in january

                  • Re: League play issue I would like adressed
                    FalconR6

                    Maybe I should give it another go. I just got disappointed playing as a lone wolf - I kept being put into position of being last man standing on too many occasions.

                    I want LP to prosper. I made a post suggesting that to entice more players into LP that there needs to be seperate lists for parties/clans and randoms. It received a luke-warm reception.

                    http://community.callofduty.com/thread/200671701

                      • Re: League play issue I would like adressed
                        deamonomic

                        I want LP to prosper too. Its the only place I can get a decent challenge on a regular basis. I love fighting for ranks. I grin when there are top 10 masters on the other team and laugh like a lunatic when they are gold and below. seriously... thats just mean.

                         

                        now that i think of it... thats my other gripe. I have seen a game 2 masters 1 gold and 1 platinum (my team) vs 2 gold and 1 silver and 1 bronze.  and the end result... well lets just say masters played like masters, platinum like platinum, gold like gold, silver like silver and bronze like bronze. It was a slaughter. Agrs rolling around at will, lightning strikes... war machine direct impacts.... the horror. XD we get +150.

                         

                        next game. 3 Masters 1 platinum on the enemy team. 3 masters 1 platinum. game starts down to 2 masters and the platinum. why? the masters on the other team were top 10 and all in a party together... scary I know, just try to contain your fear. Its hardpoint on Plaza. Once I saw Him drop I gave up hopes of winning and adopted a "make em bleed for it" policy . anyways game ends with us losing by 5 points I have more kills/deaths and defends then anyone (less caps then anyone tho I dont go in if I can help it. going in means death. if I die how can I kill the enemy? Im a slayer. I help clear the hardpoint and then I help keep them away from it.), and -150 DKP FOR NOT KNOWING WTF TO DO!  -150 for 5 points against masters.

                         

                        or you have games where you had to fight for it. it was an epic match one to be proud of all around. +10.

                          • Re: League play issue I would like adressed
                            FalconR6

                            I'm not a slayer. My KD of .92 might make some dismiss my ability. However, I know I've worked hard to win matches, attack objectives, doing the team thing. To be honest - my Zelda born reflexes are not slayer material - so I take pride in the way I go about playing. Moreover, I might be a bit old school - but I dont shy away from that scenario when your TMs leave and your left with few allies; it becomes the challenge of taking the enemy down with you.

                            However, in LP having TMs leave defies the whole point of playing. If you feel your going to lose, why not fight it out - it counts as a loss regardless. So, returning to your OP - what to do??

                            Probation is a deterent, but seldom a punishment for players. Leaving early needs to affect your ranking beyond just taking a loss.

                            I haven't been playing LP - so I'm sketchy on the points system, thus I can't suggest appropriate point deductions.

                              • Re: League play issue I would like adressed
                                JSlayer211

                                Again, as I stated previously this won't work on a peer to peer setup. Teams can host lag you out of the game altogether and guess what? That's a loss for you with whatever punishments that you are now implementing ontop of the 5 minute ban. You REALLY want to give that kind of power to the community? The power to punish other players if you get host. Imagine a team of 6 all capable of lag switching or host lagging doing whatever they want to progress up the ladder. Now multiply that by 200 as time goes on and less support for LP, it will get exponentially worse and unplayable.

                                  • Re: League play issue I would like adressed
                                    FalconR6

                                    Thanks for that. Forgive my ignorance as I'm not one to seek out ways to cheat the system. I understand what your saying know.

                                    I realize that dedis are not an option due to financial viability. So do you have any suggestions how might the "game" being able to punish those who deserve it? Maybe you could protect the innocents by only punishing those you leave on a percentage basis (much like the proby system works). If you leave too often you drop a whole division. ----- just throwing ideas out

                                      • Re: League play issue I would like adressed
                                        JSlayer211

                                        I can't think of a single idea that would address all of the issues completely but the closest I have come would be this. They need to keep track of hosts in games and have a DNF flag ontop of it all. Kind of like the one that was in other titles but tweaked a bit better. For example a game gets created. The host is chosen and the game session is given an ID, the gamertag is then stored as the host for that game, at this point and time Hostuser1 (fake gamertag lol) has Game Session 1 attached to his profile, the flag is only removed cleanly on host migration or game completion. Otherwise it results in the "deemed fit punishment." Everyone else in the lobby has a similar DNF flag placed on their gamertag, however if the host flag is not cleanly removed (dashboarded) then their flag is cleanly removed. If the host flag is cleanly removed the host receives a lighter punishment for leaving through the proper means via host migration with increasing punishments for repeat leaves over time with a drop off of flags overtime frame of a month or so. So Hostuser1 has 10 flags for the month on the anniversary date of that flag for 30 days it would drop off. Ex. if he had a quitting flag on April 13th that flag would then drop off today, the timeframe for flag removals could be modified to satisfaction. All nonhosts that quit would then have flags that continued to increase the punishments for early game departures as the quit out. They would have to figure a way to prevent the Host lag booting in order for this to work though. However, I could forsee the community being more on a watchdog sort of alert for lag booting and reporting it accordingly so that these people can be banned.

                                         

                                        Why I typed all of this out knowing full well that it won't be fixed? I don't know lol. You asked so I felt the need to answer. CoD games this late in their life cycle are pretty much dead dogs. The jackals are coming to feast on the bones of this soon abandoned title and noone really cares. Why do you think they only make one season of DLC? These games are only good for one year at best, regardless of the fact that they have all been pretty much the EXACT same game on the same old engine for so long.

                                    • Re: League play issue I would like adressed
                                      deamonomic

                                      There should be a system in place to moniter how often you "dissapear" from a game. which is to say ANY time you are gone from the lobby. I would say 6 times in 2 days gets you demoted a division.

                                       

                                      Thats probably way to strict. I wouldnt really know. I rage plenty, but I dont quit. I say "GG *Cough*I will slit all your throats next time we meet *cough*" Then I go about trying to figure out what I need to change so that I dont have a repeat of last game.

                            • Re: League play issue I would like adressed

                              I think a system like the way FIFA online works is best. In case you don't know, everyone starts out making the max amount of ladder points per game (In this case 150) every time you quit, it lowers your total score (say to 100 or 130). By completing a game, you increase your total score (so maybe you lose 10 ladder points, but your maximum score increases back to 150 for a win) That way, the random +10 for epic matches and -150 2v4 wont happen anymore. Furthermore, I think (personally) that the team system should be revamped, as even I dont like facing up against a full team of masters when my team consists of myself (master rank 9) 2 bronzes and an Iron. The matchmaking should only allow a minimum of 1 division jump (So masters can only play masters and platinum, platinum only masters, platinum, gold, and so on.) That way you won't have johnny quickscopes on your team riot shielding on SND against a good team.

                                • Re: League play issue I would like adressed

                                  And interesting point system. But it will still not really stop the quitters. Nothing ever done will stop that in this game.

                                   

                                  The system is meant to only allow a small division difference, but there is not enough players on all the time to allow it to work correctly. So if they made it any stricter it would take way longer to find matches. It takes me at times 10 minutes to find a match. Really until the list has at least 5k players all the time it will never work as it was meant too.

                                    • Re: League play issue I would like adressed
                                      deamonomic

                                      I think that there should be a system in place. 5 disconnects per divisions /week. any more then that and you get demoted to the next level down (platinum to gold). now you might be asking yourself what about you disconnecting accidentally? if your disconnecting that much then league is not for you, your likely just angering your team.  and if your internet shuts off at specific times you should be aware of that.

                                       

                                      This will punish Rage quiters/dashboarders/disconnecters (non-accidental) and make it less likely that they will either that or they will stop playing league all together. we might have a smaller player base then but atleast we will finish a game with a full lobby and get to feel like we actually earned that win/loss.

                                       

                                      This problem is out of hand Most of my league losses this season are due to this.

                                        • Re: League play issue I would like adressed

                                          I do agree about the division drop punishment for continual leavers, but then some people would probably just stay in bronze and stomp all the new players just for fun and not care if they never raised a division or not. I love staying in iron, it is funner than trying to win all the time and get to a higher division.

                                           

                                          So even with that punishment it would not stop it or slow it down, for not everyone cares about what division they are in when playing. Not everyone that plays the game even in league really cares about being the best all the time or always trying for teh win. Some just play league since they can use any setup they want and not have to worry about what rank they are to do so.

                                            • Re: League play issue I would like adressed
                                              deamonomic

                                              trialstardragon wrote:

                                               

                                              I do agree about the division drop punishment for continual leavers, but then some people would probably just stay in bronze and stomp all the new players just for fun and not care if they never raised a division or not. I love staying in iron, it is funner than trying to win all the time and get to a higher division.

                                               

                                              So even with that punishment it would not stop it or slow it down, for not everyone cares about what division they are in when playing. Not everyone that plays the game even in league really cares about being the best all the time or always trying for teh win. Some just play league since they can use any setup they want and not have to worry about what rank they are to do so.

                                              if they have a long time habit they could be removed from league play

                                      • Re: League play issue I would like adressed
                                        deamonomic

                                        League champions maintains around 3-5k. I Think it will go up still though.

                                        • Re: League play issue I would like adressed
                                          iigallowsii

                                          League play is busted and should have dedicated servers for this very reason. COD makes so much money really no excuse for not having dedicated servers for league play at the very least. Now that I'm in masters 70% of my games some one leaves or dashboards. league play is a great idea but its implementation sucks.

                                           

                                          Not to mention PARTY CHAT IN LEAGUE PLAY?????????? what a joke you cant even party chat in search and destroy on pubs how does it make any sense for league play.

                                            • Re: League play issue I would like adressed

                                              They will not put dedicated servers in to league for if they did everyone in the rest of the game would say it was not fair and the rest of the game needs them too, which has been said will not happen. So dont hold your breath, for it will not happen any time soon on this console.

                                               

                                              Even if they removed party chat people could just use skype, msn, yahoo, teamspeak, or vent to stay in a party and ignore you. Not everyone that plays leagues wants to talk or listen to random players in a lobby. Not everyone wants to hear the whiners, the ranters, the ragers, the singers, the tweakers and the screamers when playing.

                                              • Re: League play issue I would like adressed
                                                deamonomic

                                                iigallowsii wrote:

                                                 

                                                League play is busted and should have dedicated servers for this very reason. COD makes so much money really no excuse for not having dedicated servers for league play at the very least. Now that I'm in masters 70% of my games some one leaves or dashboards. league play is a great idea but its implementation sucks.

                                                 

                                                Not to mention PARTY CHAT IN LEAGUE PLAY?????????? what a joke you cant even party chat in search and destroy on pubs how does it make any sense for league play.

                                                in champions league (the only one that really matters imo) everyone 4 bars all the times in my games with the odd 3 bars from time to time.